On 2006-07-22 08:34:42 -0400, ·········@yahoo.com said:
> http://fmciler.blogspot.com/2006/07/yeni-bir-lisp-videosu.html
The supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll.
Raffael Cavallaro wrote:
> On 2006-07-22 08:34:42 -0400, ·········@yahoo.com said:
>
> > http://fmciler.blogspot.com/2006/07/yeni-bir-lisp-videosu.html
>
> The supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll.
It isn't even a very good one. Hell I know next to nothing about lisp
and I could do better. Should I be happy or sad that the rise of
internet popularity has reduced the intelligence of trolls along with
everything else?
"ajones" <·······@gmail.com> writes:
> Raffael Cavallaro wrote:
>> On 2006-07-22 08:34:42 -0400, ·········@yahoo.com said:
>>
>> > http://fmciler.blogspot.com/2006/07/yeni-bir-lisp-videosu.html
>>
>> The supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll.
>
> It isn't even a very good one. Hell I know next to nothing about lisp
> and I could do better. Should I be happy or sad that the rise of
> internet popularity has reduced the intelligence of trolls along with
> everything else?
>
Be happy that some troll thought it was worth doing an anti-lisp
movie. It is a positive thing - like virus writers, they don't bother
putting the effort in unless they feel there is a sizable audience.
Tim
--
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au
From: Bulent Murtezaoglu
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <87ejwbl4la.fsf@p4.internal>
>>>>> "TimX" == Tim X <Tim> writes:
[...]
TimX> Be happy that some troll thought it was worth doing an
TimX> anti-lisp movie. It is a positive thing - like virus
TimX> writers, they don't bother putting the effort in unless they
TimX> feel there is a sizable audience.
Yeah. In case you guys didn't quite get it, this particular site
targets (among other things) the Turkish lisp effort. Yours truly and
others have also been accused of being destructive to Turkish youth in
the same web site. Very gratifying indeed. I'll conclude my work
here has been done when people start bothering me and the other local
lispers with crank calls. (I already got mild swearing in anonymous
e-mail so we're past that stage).
There appears to be something about lisp and lispers that riles
people.
cheers,
BM
From: Ken Tilton
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <3v4xg.2$LZ7.1@fe10.lga>
Bulent Murtezaoglu wrote:
>>>>>>"TimX" == Tim X <Tim> writes:
>
> [...]
> TimX> Be happy that some troll thought it was worth doing an
> TimX> anti-lisp movie. It is a positive thing - like virus
> TimX> writers, they don't bother putting the effort in unless they
> TimX> feel there is a sizable audience.
>
> Yeah. In case you guys didn't quite get it, this particular site
> targets (among other things) the Turkish lisp effort. Yours truly and
> others have also been accused of being destructive to Turkish youth ...
They want you to copy them first?
hth, ken
--
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
"I'll say I'm losing my grip, and it feels terrific."
-- Smiling husband to scowling wife, New Yorker cartoon
From: Emre Sevinc
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <877j1vi33p.fsf@ileriseviye.org>
>>>>> "KT" == Ken Tilton <·········@gmail.com> writes:
KT> Bulent Murtezaoglu wrote:
>>>>>>> "TimX" == Tim X <Tim> writes:
>> [...]
TimX> Be happy that some troll thought it was worth doing an
TimX> anti-lisp movie. It is a positive thing - like virus
TimX> writers, they don't bother putting the effort in unless they
TimX> feel there is a sizable audience.
>> Yeah. In case you guys didn't quite get it, this particular
>> site targets (among other things) the Turkish lisp effort.
>> Yours truly and others have also been accused of being
>> destructive to Turkish youth ...
KT> They want you to copy them first?
My candidate for the double entendre of the year! [1]
;-)
1- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_entendre
--
Emre Sevinc
eMBA Software Developer Actively engaged in:
http://emba.bilgi.edu.tr http://ileriseviye.org
http://www.bilgi.edu.tr http://fazlamesai.net
Cognitive Science Student http://cazci.com
http://www.cogsci.boun.edu.tr
From: Robert Strandh
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <6wmzayx62m.fsf@serveur5.labri.fr>
Bulent Murtezaoglu <··@acm.org> writes:
> Yours truly and
> others have also been accused of being destructive to Turkish youth in
> the same web site.
Interesting. A while ago when I gave a presentation about Lisp to my
research group, I was accused by one person of trying to "divide" the
group (in which most members use C++).
--
Robert Strandh
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Greenspun's Tenth Rule of Programming: any sufficiently complicated C
or Fortran program contains an ad hoc informally-specified bug-ridden
slow implementation of half of Common Lisp.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Ken Tilton
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <7Dcxg.95$ht4.85@fe12.lga>
Robert Strandh wrote:
> Bulent Murtezaoglu <··@acm.org> writes:
>
>
>>Yours truly and
>>others have also been accused of being destructive to Turkish youth in
>>the same web site.
>
>
> Interesting. A while ago when I gave a presentation about Lisp to my
> research group, I was accused by one person of trying to "divide" the
> group (in which most members use C++).
>
Ah, there's no place like academia for dispassionate, intellectually
honest discussion of new ideas on their merits. Thank god for tenure
giving your bold antagonist the protection they needed to shout down
your iconoclastic..... hang on...
kt
--
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
"I'll say I'm losing my grip, and it feels terrific."
-- Smiling husband to scowling wife, New Yorker cartoon
From: Bulent Murtezaoglu
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <873bcql1vu.fsf@p4.internal>
>>>>> "KT" == Ken Tilton <·········@gmail.com> writes:
KT> Robert Strandh wrote:
>> ... I was accused by one person of trying to
>> "divide" the group (in which most members use C++).
>>
KT> Ah, there's no place like academia for dispassionate,
KT> intellectually honest discussion of new ideas on their
KT> merits. [...]
Lisp is a _new_ idea?
cheers,
BM
From: Ken Tilton
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <d9ixg.1794$9r1.947@fe11.lga>
Bulent Murtezaoglu wrote:
>>>>>>"KT" == Ken Tilton <·········@gmail.com> writes:
>
> KT> Robert Strandh wrote:
>
> >> ... I was accused by one person of trying to
> >> "divide" the group (in which most members use C++).
> >>
>
> KT> Ah, there's no place like academia for dispassionate,
> KT> intellectually honest discussion of new ideas on their
> KT> merits. [...]
>
> Lisp is a _new_ idea?
Shhhhhhhhh.
kenny
--
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
"I'll say I'm losing my grip, and it feels terrific."
-- Smiling husband to scowling wife, New Yorker cartoon
Robert Strandh <·······@labri.fr> writes:
> Bulent Murtezaoglu <··@acm.org> writes:
>
>> Yours truly and
>> others have also been accused of being destructive to Turkish youth in
>> the same web site.
>
> Interesting. A while ago when I gave a presentation about Lisp to my
> research group, I was accused by one person of trying to "divide" the
> group (in which most members use C++).
>
Unfortunately, many people cannot distinguish between professional
critical comment and personal attack. I had a similar experience
recently when I advised a group they needed to re-examine there
database models. They had made the common mistake of believing that
putting constraints into your database takes away from flexibility. I
tried to explain this is only the case when your data model is not a
true reflection of the domain being modelled. There response was, "So,
you think everything we have done is shit.",
I wanted to say, "Well, your using VB and C++, have no standard approach or
libraries between all the related applications, have a totally
denormalised database with thousands of orphaned records and gigabytes
of data anomalies, have incorrect results from many of your
applications because you forgot about rounding error when dealing with
floats and have not been able to get a project in on time for over 18
months - yes, what your doing is shit." However, since they are paying
me $800 per day to tell them the bleeding obvious, I decided a bit of
tact would achieve more. I told them they had some "unique" and
"interesting" approaches, but were running the very real risk of being
unemployed within the next couple of months if they don't actually
produce a marketable product.
and before you ask, I did manage to work lisp into some of the
discussion - but to be honest, these guys have enough problems with VB
and had all the standard "Oh yeah, but lets see you solve a real world
problem with it". One (the most junior programmer) was interested and
I pointed him to Peter's PCL.
also, $800 per day is Australian, which makes it only 72 cents in the
US dollar and if it wasn't for the fact I have another full-time job
and did this as a bit of moonlighting, I probably wouldn't have been
as comfortable to ask for that much per day - I took a punt and they
accepted it.
The really sad thing here is this company has been producing this
crappy software and selling it successfully all over the world - its a
specialised field (Agriculture/farming) and I don't think there is
much competition. Still, they have been successful for about 20 years,
but I think the run is coming to an end.
Tim
Tim X <····@nospam.dev.null> wrote:
> Robert Strandh <·······@labri.fr> writes:
>
> > Interesting. A while ago when I gave a presentation about Lisp to my
> > research group, I was accused by one person of trying to "divide" the
> > group (in which most members use C++).
>
> Unfortunately, many people cannot distinguish between professional
> critical comment and personal attack. [...] I decided a bit of
> tact would achieve more. I told them they had some "unique" and
> "interesting" approaches [...]
Sounds like mismatched tact filters:
<URL:http://www.mit.edu/~jcb/tact.html>
--
Duncan Harvey
··············@abbrvtd.org.uk (Duncan Harvey) writes:
> Tim X <····@nospam.dev.null> wrote:
>
>> Robert Strandh <·······@labri.fr> writes:
>>
>> > Interesting. A while ago when I gave a presentation about Lisp to my
>> > research group, I was accused by one person of trying to "divide" the
>> > group (in which most members use C++).
>>
>> Unfortunately, many people cannot distinguish between professional
>> critical comment and personal attack. [...] I decided a bit of
>> tact would achieve more. I told them they had some "unique" and
>> "interesting" approaches [...]
>
> Sounds like mismatched tact filters:
> <URL:http://www.mit.edu/~jcb/tact.html>
>
Hehehe - Unfortunately, I think given their response, their tact
filter was not just a mismatch, it was totally inverted and instead of
filtering, it magnified!
Tim
--
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au
On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 12:44:33 +0300, <··@acm.org> wrote:
>
> There appears to be something about lisp and lispers that riles
> people.
Fear.
Fear that someone might be doing 'it' better than they.
Ever lisp gathering I've been to has a zillion similtaneous [1]
conversations ongoing. I cannot think of any other gatherings even
remotely similar. The mental energy is just wild.
[1] since cl-yahoo broke, I cannot spell anymore :-(
--
Reply-To email is ignored.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
From: Ken Tilton
Subject: Re: Warning: supposed "lisp video" is an anti-lisp troll
Date:
Message-ID: <Hccyg.278$v75.251@fe10.lga>
GP lisper wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 12:44:33 +0300, <··@acm.org> wrote:
>
>>There appears to be something about lisp and lispers that riles
>>people.
>
>
> Fear.
>
> Fear that someone might be doing 'it' better than they.
I was thinking it was fear they have to go directly to jail, not get
$100, give up all their property and start over. Pretty soon the
immigration debate in the US will be over because the economy will
collapse and the boldest of us will be lowering ourselves into holds of
rusty freighters for a cruise to China where we will start over at the
bottom, despised as foreigners. That is what it is like for a Java
programmer when The Day Soon Comes and he (relax, they will all be male)
has to slink his sorry ass into comp.lang.lisp and grovel before The
True Lisp Godz begging for enlightenment.
>
> Ever lisp gathering I've been to has a zillion similtaneous [1]
> conversations ongoing. I cannot think of any other gatherings even
> remotely similar. The mental energy is just wild.
I hear you saying that a Lispnik meeting is the only thing you can
attend and still wish you had a video. (Exceptions better kept to ourelves.)
kenny
--
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
"I'll say I'm losing my grip, and it feels terrific."
-- Smiling husband to scowling wife, New Yorker cartoon
On 23 Jul 2006 23:10:46 -0700, <·······@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> It isn't even a very good one. Hell I know next to nothing about lisp
> and I could do better. Should I be happy or sad that the rise of
> internet popularity has reduced the intelligence of trolls along with
> everything else?
They didn't just pop out of nowhere, magically created by the internet
(although there are some professional trolls working under multiple
names). They were in our world anyway. Remember the kids in the back
of the school room always trying to get someone caught?
--
Reply-To email is ignored.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
You see, the problem is that you forgot to close all the parens.
Otherwise you can compile a file with COMPILE-FILE instead. I've had
great success with paredit. Might want to try it.
·········@yahoo.com wrote:
> http://fmciler.blogspot.com/2006/07/yeni-bir-lisp-videosu.html