Some time ago I saw that Super Mario 64 was developed using Lisp. The
only available detail was that Nichimen N-World was used. Somebody
(maybe from Franz) has more details about the SM64 development? It was
prototyped with N-World so first running inside it on a PC, or N-World
was used only to make the models? Maybe Lisp was used to develop a DSL
that compiled to the console assembler like in Crash Bandicoot
development? It was the only game developed at Nintendo using Lisp?
What about Zelda 64 (developed at the same time I think)?
Just curious.
nahuel wrote:
> Some time ago I saw that Super Mario 64 was developed using Lisp. The
> only available detail was that Nichimen N-World was used. Somebody
> (maybe from Franz) has more details about the SM64 development? It was
> prototyped with N-World so first running inside it on a PC, or N-World
> was used only to make the models? Maybe Lisp was used to develop a DSL
> that compiled to the console assembler like in Crash Bandicoot
> development? It was the only game developed at Nintendo using Lisp?
> What about Zelda 64 (developed at the same time I think)?
>
> Just curious.
I only vaguely remember the Nichimen middleware solution and I don't
remember any mention of lisp. It was a full 3d solution including art
pipeline and tools plus game code, and my guess would be that if it did
utilise lisp it was as an interpreted scripting language.
"justinhj" <········@gmail.com> writes:
> I only vaguely remember the Nichimen middleware solution and I don't
> remember any mention of lisp. It was a full 3d solution including art
> pipeline and tools plus game code, and my guess would be that if it did
> utilise lisp it was as an interpreted scripting language.
Not so.
http://www.franz.com/success/customer_apps/animation_graphics/nichimen.lhtml
Zach
Zach Beane wrote:
> "justinhj" <········@gmail.com> writes:
>
> > I only vaguely remember the Nichimen middleware solution and I don't
> > remember any mention of lisp. It was a full 3d solution including art
> > pipeline and tools plus game code, and my guess would be that if it did
> > utilise lisp it was as an interpreted scripting language.
>
> Not so.
>
> http://www.franz.com/success/customer_apps/animation_graphics/nichimen.lhtml
>
> Zach
Wow that is interesting... it also means that two of my favourite video
games of all time were both developed with lisp... this one and Jak and
Daxter!
Justin
I think that is an exaggeration to say that SM64 was developed in Lisp
if the only Lisp involvement was being the implementation language for
the modeller used. It's like if you made a game using C++ for
programming and the wings3D modeller for the art, and then you say that
your game was created using Erlang... when you didn't touch a line in
that language. So, I don't know if the claim that SM64 was developed
using Lisp is a marketing exaggeration from Franz or has a solid base,
so my question.
nahuel wrote:
> I think that is an exaggeration to say that SM64 was developed in Lisp
> if the only Lisp involvement was being the implementation language for
> the modeller used. It's like if you made a game using C++ for
> programming and the wings3D modeller for the art, and then you say that
> your game was created using Erlang... when you didn't touch a line in
> that language. So, I don't know if the claim that SM64 was developed
> using Lisp is a marketing exaggeration from Franz or has a solid base,
> so my question.
Well Nichimen is not just a modeller, it was a game content creation
tool, which means it was used for much more than just models... game
logic would have been programmed within the toolset.
Justin
justinhj wrote:
>
> Well Nichimen is not just a modeller, it was a game content creation
> tool, which means it was used for much more than just models... game
> logic would have been programmed within the toolset.
>
So, you can code an entire SM64 like game that runs inside Mirai
(N-World descent)? If true, is very exciting, maybe I need to buy
Mirai (it's alive?) :)
"nahuel" <······@gmail.com> writes:
> I think that is an exaggeration to say that SM64 was developed in Lisp
> if the only Lisp involvement was being the implementation language for
> the modeller used. It's like if you made a game using C++ for
> programming and the wings3D modeller for the art, and then you say that
> your game was created using Erlang... when you didn't touch a line in
> that language. So, I don't know if the claim that SM64 was developed
> using Lisp is a marketing exaggeration from Franz or has a solid base,
> so my question.
Well, MacOS and MS-Windows wouldn't exist without LISP.
MS-Windows comes from MacOS.
MacOS comes from Xerox.
Xerox comes from Smaltalk.
Smalltalk comes from LISP.
Without LISP nothing of all this would have evolved ;-)
(With my excuses to Doug Engelbart).
--
__Pascal Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/
This is a signature virus. Add me to your signature and help me to live
On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 06:26:49 +0100, Pascal Bourguignon
<····@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>
> Well, MacOS and MS-Windows wouldn't exist without LISP.
>
> MS-Windows comes from MacOS.
> MacOS comes from Xerox.
> Xerox comes from Smaltalk.
> Smalltalk comes from LISP.
>
> Without LISP nothing of all this would have evolved ;-)
Utter nonsense..
For one thing MS-DOS comes from CP/M.
Windows from MS-DOS.
Windows-NT/2000/2003/Xp are all based on the designs of
the old PRISM (an OS) group from DEC.
It performs approximately the same tasks as UNIX.
(MAC-OS10 on up have a unix kernel I understand)
GUI inspired by Mac but also X-windows.
Smalltalk takes inspiration from several sources
like SIMULA and also LISP. (Yes, the old style is intentional)
Seems you need to broaden your mind just a little..
Sure Lisp has contributed many ideas over the years, but
it is hardly the only thing that has.
(yes, I know it was meant as a pun :)
That being said in my mind LISP was a language that was discovered
not invented. Lambda calculus is a far more approachable way
of computing that Turing machines are. It reflects the
recursive (causal) nature of the universe.
In it's evoulution to become practical and fast it is no longer
a thing of beauty but it keeps all the power and some of the simplicity of
the original form.
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/
John Thingstad <··············@chello.no> wrote:
+---------------
| For one thing MS-DOS comes from CP/M.
+---------------
Which was inspired by (or which copied) the command line
appearances of RT-11 and/or OS/8, which copied the command
line of TOPS-10. DIR, COPY, DEL. Viva 36 bits! ;-}
-Rob
-----
Rob Warnock <····@rpw3.org>
627 26th Avenue <URL:http://rpw3.org/>
San Mateo, CA 94403 (650)572-2607
On 2005-11-28 04:14:08 -0500, "John Thingstad" <··············@chello.no> said:
> Windows from MS-DOS.
A court decided that MS Windows copied 189 GUI elements from Mac OS -
179 of these MS had licensed from Apple and the other 10 were not
copyrightable. So Windows really is a pretty straight copy of the Mac.
Windows was MS's attempt to get something that looked and felt like the
Mac running atop DOS. This doesn't mean that DOS was the origin of
Windows any more than the Motorola 68000 instruction set was the origin
of the Mac.