This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
Lisp is now an `A-' language.
The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
> This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
>
> ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
>
> Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> Lisp is now an `A-' language.
>
> The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
>
> http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
The list is bogus; it also lists as "other programming languages"
both Scheme (in 25th place) and CL (in 36th place). If these were
grouped with Lisp, according to the second FAQ entry, then the rates
would jump. It is obviously unfair to separate something called
Common Lisp from Lisp, and I'm sure Schemers would say that as well
about Scheme (though it is not an obvious conclusion to draw based
strictly on names).
I've sent a message to the given email addresses, asking them to
group Lisp, Common Lisp (CL), Scheme, emacs-lisp, Autolisp, and
Dylan into one category. If there are others I've missed that
might make a statistical difference, feel free to also mention it to
····@tiobe.com and ·········@tiobe.com
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
Duane Rettig <·····@franz.com> writes:
> Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
>
> > This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
> >
> > ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
> >
> > Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> > rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> > Lisp is now an `A-' language.
> >
> > The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
> >
> > http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
>
> The list is bogus; it also lists as "other programming languages"
> both Scheme (in 25th place) and CL (in 36th place). If these were
> grouped with Lisp, according to the second FAQ entry, then the rates
> would jump. It is obviously unfair to separate something called
> Common Lisp from Lisp, and I'm sure Schemers would say that as well
> about Scheme (though it is not an obvious conclusion to draw based
> strictly on names).
>
> I've sent a message to the given email addresses, asking them to
> group Lisp, Common Lisp (CL), Scheme, emacs-lisp, Autolisp, and
> Dylan into one category. If there are others I've missed that
> might make a statistical difference, feel free to also mention it to
> ····@tiobe.com and ·········@tiobe.com
I also sent them the following urls for backup:
http://www.alu.org/
http://www.alu.org/table/history.htm#family
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
Duane Rettig <·····@franz.com> writes:
> Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
>
>> This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
>>
>> ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
>>
>> Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
>> rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
>> Lisp is now an `A-' language.
>>
>> The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
>>
>> http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
>
> The list is bogus;
Of course it is. But when it's bogus in our favor it's useful. When
someone complains that Lisp is a `fringe language' you can point to a
web site that says it is `mainstream'.
> it also lists as "other programming languages"
> both Scheme (in 25th place) and CL (in 36th place).
I believe that CL on the list is more likely to be the OS/400 CL
Programming Language rather than Common Lisp.
Joe Marshall wrote:
> Duane Rettig <·····@franz.com> writes:
>>Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
>>
>>>This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
>>>
>>>ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
>>>
>>>Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
>>>rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
>>>Lisp is now an `A-' language.
>>>
>>>The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
>>>
>>>http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
>>
>>The list is bogus;
>
> Of course it is. But when it's bogus in our favor it's useful. When
> someone complains that Lisp is a `fringe language' you can point to a
> web site that says it is `mainstream'.
That's a dangerous attitude to have. I'd much prefer to tell the truth,
*especially when it is not in my favor*, so people don't suspect me of
lying just to make myself look better.
-- MJF
I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
and i got this in reply :
http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
·············@hotmail.com writes:
> I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
> and i got this in reply :
> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
All this means is that VB shops use monster.com to find prospective
employees, and Lisp shops do not.
Check out
http://www.franz.com/careers/jobs/outside/
How many VB jobs do you see there?
:-)
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
Duane Rettig wrote:
> ·············@hotmail.com writes:
>
>> I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
>> and i got this in reply :
>> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
>> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
>
> All this means is that VB shops use monster.com to find prospective
> employees, and Lisp shops do not.
>
> Check out
>
> http://www.franz.com/careers/jobs/outside/
>
> How many VB jobs do you see there?
>
> :-)
Even in the last six months there haven't been too many Lisp jobs
listed, though. One isn't many...
--
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people
all day long and I assume they deserve it.
Dogbert
Ulrich Hobelmann <···········@web.de> writes:
> Duane Rettig wrote:
> > ·············@hotmail.com writes:
> >
>
> >> I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
> >> and i got this in reply :
> >> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
> >> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
> > All this means is that VB shops use monster.com to find prospective
>
> > employees, and Lisp shops do not.
> > Check out http://www.franz.com/careers/jobs/outside/
>
> > How many VB jobs do you see there?
>
> > :-)
>
>
> Even in the last six months there haven't been too many Lisp jobs
> listed, though. One isn't many...
Like LoC, I find it interesting how people tend to make more of
certain measurements than they're worth. Better jobs are indeed
harder to find, and not necessarily advertised. You are certainly
free to assign some connection between that and Lisp popularity (the
subject of this thread) but as any High School presidential candidate
learns, popularity isn't necessarily tied to winning the most votes,
especially if you know how those votes were gathered.
And, like LoC measurements, I tend to pay attention to the negative
side of such kinds of measurements - a person who gets paid by the
number of lines of code he writes will certainly write many lines of
code. But to say that that constituetes a good programmer - in fact
it would tend to negate the good programming - I've always joked that
my LoC numbers would tend to force me to pay my Company - not the other
way around. And yes, I do consider it to be a sign of a good programmer
to be able to remove code. The same thing happens in literature; it
may take a certain time to write a two-page report, but to write a
one-page report might take twice as long.
All this to say that while job postings might be an indicator trend
within a certain market, it is not necessarily a good indicator to
use for comparisons between different markets. in all measurement
and comparison situations, one must always be careful of the actual
measurement methodologies and how close they actually come to describing
reality.
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
Duane Rettig wrote:
> Ulrich Hobelmann <···········@web.de> writes:
>
> > Duane Rettig wrote:
> > > ·············@hotmail.com writes:
> > >
> >
> > >> I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
> > >> and i got this in reply :
> > >> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
> > >> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
> > > All this means is that VB shops use monster.com to find prospective
> >
> > > employees, and Lisp shops do not.
> > > Check out http://www.franz.com/careers/jobs/outside/
> >
> > > How many VB jobs do you see there?
> >
> > > :-)
> >
> >
> > Even in the last six months there haven't been too many Lisp jobs
> > listed, though. One isn't many...
>
> Like LoC, I find it interesting how people tend to make more of
> certain measurements than they're worth. Better jobs are indeed
> harder to find, and not necessarily advertised. You are certainly
> free to assign some connection between that and Lisp popularity (the
> subject of this thread) but as any High School presidential candidate
> learns, popularity isn't necessarily tied to winning the most votes,
> especially if you know how those votes were gathered.
>
> And, like LoC measurements, I tend to pay attention to the negative
> side of such kinds of measurements - a person who gets paid by the
> number of lines of code he writes will certainly write many lines of
> code. But to say that that constituetes a good programmer - in fact
> it would tend to negate the good programming - I've always joked that
> my LoC numbers would tend to force me to pay my Company - not the other
> way around. And yes, I do consider it to be a sign of a good programmer
> to be able to remove code. The same thing happens in literature; it
> may take a certain time to write a two-page report, but to write a
> one-page report might take twice as long.
>
> All this to say that while job postings might be an indicator trend
> within a certain market, it is not necessarily a good indicator to
> use for comparisons between different markets. in all measurement
> and comparison situations, one must always be careful of the actual
> measurement methodologies and how close they actually come to describing
> reality.
>
> --
> Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
> 555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
> Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
We could compare only Lisp jobs that are visible , there might a
thousands
of Lisp jobs which i don't have a clue about it , so if you have any
other
info please post it .
Second Franz is a Lisp vendor so it couldn't measure Non-Lisp jobs
like
looking for a Linux job at Microsoft while Monster covers both
categories
and many more .Here are the numbers of other sites:
VB .net
http://www.careerbuilder.com/jobseeker/jobs/jobresults.aspx?IPATH=SQ&vt=detail&cibookmark=1&jrdid=&strCrit=QID%3dA6652243748829%3bst%3dQ%3buse%3dALL%3brawWords%3dvisual+basic+.net%3bCID%3dUS%3bSID%3dALL%3bTID%3d0%3bENR%3dNO%3bDTP%3dDR3%3bYDI%3dYES%3bIND%3dALL%3bPDQ%3dAll%3bJN%3dAll%3bPAYL%3d0%3bPAYH%3dgt120%3bPOY%3dNO%3bETD%3dALL%3bRE%3dALL%3bMGT%3dDC%3bSUP%3dDC%3bFRE%3d30%3bCHL%3dAL%3bQS%3dsid_unknown%3bSS%3dNO%3bTITL%3d0%3bVT%3ddetail%3bJQT%3dRAD&sname=
http://www.jobs.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.Net
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/jobseeker/jobsearch/search_results.html?type=main&metro_area=1&country1=USA&page_number=1&order_by=relevancy&reverse_order=0&banded_display=1&search_type_form=quick&updated_since=sixtydays&related_titles=4&detailed_display=1&pref_display=0&intl=us&save_recent=1&keywords_all=Visual+Basic+.Net&ulm_input1=&industry1=
Common Lisp
http://www.careerbuilder.com/jobseeker/jobs/jobresults.aspx?IPATH=SQ&vt=detail&cibookmark=1&jrdid=&strCrit=QID%3dA6652243748843%3bst%3dQ%3buse%3dALL%3brawWords%3dcommon+lisp%3bCID%3dUS%3bSID%3dALL%3bTID%3d0%3bENR%3dNO%3bDTP%3dDR3%3bYDI%3dYES%3bIND%3dALL%3bPDQ%3dAll%3bJN%3dAll%3bPAYL%3d0%3bPAYH%3dgt120%3bPOY%3dNO%3bETD%3dALL%3bRE%3dALL%3bMGT%3dDC%3bSUP%3dDC%3bFRE%3d30%3bCHL%3dAL%3bQS%3dsid_unknown%3bSS%3dNO%3bTITL%3d0%3bVT%3ddetail%3bJQT%3dRAD&sname=
http://www.jobs.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp
http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/jobseeker/jobsearch/search_results.html?keywords_all=Common+Lisp&country1=USA&search_type_form=quick&updated_since=sixtydays&basicsearch=0&advancedsearch=0&metro_area=1&search=Search&kw=Common%2BLisp
Listen i'm not looking for a job, nor i'm saying that numbers posted
are perfect , i just mailed my ex colleagues to tell that Lisp is not
such obscure language as they think .
·············@hotmail.com writes:
> Duane Rettig wrote:
> > Ulrich Hobelmann <···········@web.de> writes:
> >
> > All this to say that while job postings might be an indicator trend
> > within a certain market, it is not necessarily a good indicator to
> > use for comparisons between different markets. in all measurement
> > and comparison situations, one must always be careful of the actual
> > measurement methodologies and how close they actually come to describing
> > reality.
> >
> > --
> > Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
> > 555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
> > Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
> We could compare only Lisp jobs that are visible, there might a thousands
> of Lisp jobs which i don't have a clue about it, so if you have any other
> info please post it .
> Second Franz is a Lisp vendor so it couldn't measure Non-Lisp jobs
> like looking for a Linux job at Microsoft while Monster covers both
> categories and many more
Neither of these are relevant to the actual number of Lisp jobs there
are in the world. They might be relevant to the number of non-filled
Lisp jobs in the world, but that does not indicate Lisp's lack of
popularity, but instead it indicates Lisp's _stability_.
Let me give you the example of my own company, Franz Inc. We get
requests every year for employment, and when such requests come to
me, I tell them this story: I started consulting for Franz while
working for Amdahl (with their written permission) in 1985, and I
went to full employee status in 1987 (Franz was started in 1984).
In 1986, a picture was taken of the developers at Franz, and a note
was written on the picture that I was not available for the photo.
It hung on John Foderaro's door for many years while we were located
in Berkeley.
Now, we have a few people that work in the development department
as ancillary developers/supporters, and we have over the years hired
consultants and others for specific tasks, but in that 19 year time
period only one of the developers in that picture has left us, and
only one other who is not in the picture, who was hired a "mere" 15
years ago, came too late for the picture.
Now, how are you going to measure those very stable jobs? There's
no way you can do that. Is this an example of the unhealthy nature
of Lisp in the job market? No! It is quite the opposite.
> Listen i'm not looking for a job, nor i'm saying that numbers posted
> are perfect , i just mailed my ex colleagues to tell that Lisp is not
> such obscure language as they think .
And your ex colleagues responded in desparation by pointing to a
useless (for Lisp) measurement. It would be much the same as telling
me that I'm not a very good programmer because I have a low or even
negative LoC count.
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
·············@hotmail.com wrote:
> I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
> and i got this in reply :
> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
> http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
And it only mentions the word Lisp once, in between C/C++, Java, and Python.
Well, if the prophet doesn't go to the mountain, the mountain has to
come to the prophet ;)
--
I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people
all day long and I assume they deserve it.
Dogbert
Ulrich Hobelmann wrote:
> ·············@hotmail.com wrote:
> > I send this Tiobe chart to some former colleagues of mine
> > and i got this in reply :
> > http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Visual+Basic+.net&cn=&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&re=14&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863
> > http://jobsearch.monster.com/jobsearch.asp?q=Common+Lisp&re=0&sort=rv&vw=b&cy=US&brd=1%2C128%2C1862%2C1863&rad=&zip=&x=0&y=0
>
> And it only mentions the word Lisp once, in between C/C++, Java, and Python.
>
> Well, if the prophet doesn't go to the mountain, the mountain has to
> come to the prophet ;)
>
> --
> I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people
> all day long and I assume they deserve it.
> Dogbert
One of the reason might be the number of Lispers working with C/Basic
type
of languages who won't miss a chance of a lifetime finally doing Lisp
at their
workplace and being payed for that.
I was one of them , though i can't escape from C/C++ completely life is
much better.
Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
> Duane Rettig <·····@franz.com> writes:
>
> > Joe Marshall <···@ccs.neu.edu> writes:
> >
> >> This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
> >>
> >> ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
> >>
> >> Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> >> rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> >> Lisp is now an `A-' language.
> >>
> >> The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
> >>
> >> http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
> >
> > The list is bogus;
>
> Of course it is. But when it's bogus in our favor it's useful. When
> someone complains that Lisp is a `fringe language' you can point to a
> web site that says it is `mainstream'.
It's not in our favor; it is biased in the negative direction, since it
doesn't combine the hits of the related language references.
> > it also lists as "other programming languages"
> > both Scheme (in 25th place) and CL (in 36th place).
>
> I believe that CL on the list is more likely to be the OS/400 CL
> Programming Language rather than Common Lisp.
Yes, this was explained by Paul Jansen (who has apparently also
posted here). He has answered my email, and indicated some changes
will be made next month. I requested a clarification to his answer.
If he replies I will summarize here; perhaps he will in fact answer
here (he is welcome to do so).
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
A followup:
Duane Rettig <·····@franz.com> writes:
> Yes, this was explained by Paul Jansen (who has apparently also
> posted here). He has answered my email, and indicated some changes
> will be made next month. I requested a clarification to his answer.
> If he replies I will summarize here; perhaps he will in fact answer
> here (he is welcome to do so).
Paul has indeed answered me, and confirmed my suspicions about the
measurement technique. He has promised to make a wishlist item
to try fix the methodology for next month's posting.
The issue is how they combine related groups - they only take the
max of each group as the total. So if Language A and B are related,
and Language A has 100 hits and language B has 90 hits, but there are
35 hits which refer to both A and B, then 100 is used. I suggested
using a Venn Diagram, taking the union of the area under both A and
B hits, with methods to cound the A + B hits only once. He agreed
that this was desirable, and intends to fix it.
So all of the combined language numbers are likely to go up when
they make this change (e.g. various Basics), but so also will the
Lisp numbers, once scheme and Dylan are properly combined with the
Lisp category.
--
Duane Rettig ·····@franz.com Franz Inc. http://www.franz.com/
555 12th St., Suite 1450 http://www.555citycenter.com/
Oakland, Ca. 94607 Phone: (510) 452-2000; Fax: (510) 452-0182
Joe Marshall schreef:
> This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
>
> ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
>
> Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> Lisp is now an `A-' language.
>
> The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
>
> http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
The reason is quite simple. As you can see in the Trendmapper overview
Yahoo has made a considerable change in the way they calculate the
number of hits. Trendmapper uses absolute values, whereas the TPC index
uses relative values.
Since all languages have had this boost of hits from Yahoo, and the
boost was non-linear (the topmost languages profit more than the small
ones), the relative market share of the smaller language decreased. So
it had nothing to do with Lisp itself.
Fortunately, this has hardly any influence on the position of the
language, but it certainly affects the ratings. We (TIOBE) are not
happy with these fluctuations but once in a while one of the search
engines we use for tracking "goes wild".
Hope this answers your question.
--
Paul Jansen - TIOBE Software, http://www.tiobe.com
De Zaale 11 Postbus 80 5600 AB Eindhoven, the Netherlands
Phone: +31 40 239 0870 Mobile: +31 617 400 620
*** TIOBE Software - The Coding Standards Company ***
···········@tiobe.com wrote:
> Joe Marshall schreef:
>
> > This month, Tiobe http://www.tiobe.com/
> >
> > ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
> >
> > Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> > rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> > Lisp is now an `A-' language.
> >
> > The Trendmap for Lisp doesn't seem to indicate a decline, though.
> >
> > http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
>
> The reason is quite simple. As you can see in the Trendmapper overview
> Yahoo has made a considerable change in the way they calculate the
> number of hits. Trendmapper uses absolute values, whereas the TPC index
> uses relative values.
>
> Since all languages have had this boost of hits from Yahoo, and the
> boost was non-linear (the topmost languages profit more than the small
> ones), the relative market share of the smaller language decreased. So
> it had nothing to do with Lisp itself.
>
> Fortunately, this has hardly any influence on the position of the
> language, but it certainly affects the ratings. We (TIOBE) are not
> happy with these fluctuations but once in a while one of the search
> engines we use for tracking "goes wild".
>
> Hope this answers your question.
>
> --
> Paul Jansen - TIOBE Software, http://www.tiobe.com
> De Zaale 11 Postbus 80 5600 AB Eindhoven, the Netherlands
> Phone: +31 40 239 0870 Mobile: +31 617 400 620
> *** TIOBE Software - The Coding Standards Company ***
Thanks for your explanation Paul,is it going to be too much
to ask to include Long Term Trends chart for the 11-20 ranked
languages (i assume that putting them with top ten would make
chart barely readable)?
Joe Marshall wrote:
> http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/lisp.html
Considering this is c.l.l common lisp chart seems more suited
:http://www.trendmapper.com/charts/pages/-commonlisp-_id02042005-51.html
Joe Marshall schrieb:
> ranks Lisp as number 14 with a rating of .688%
> Even though Lisp has moved from 15th to 14th place in the list, the
> rating took a huge hit (it was at .973% last month). Unfortunately,
> Lisp is now an `A-' language.
:).
So, surfing around last night I found on clisp-homepage: Vote for us
with 2 options (to vote-lists). Nice.
Following the link shows something ... �hm.
There is the well known clisp.png icon 42x42 pixel and this is maximized
to usual banner-size (600x..) in one of that ranking lists.
Now, is this the palce to call for a competition in creating a nice
clisp banner? I think this is necessary when the aim is to go upside in
the programming heaven: a nice layout for representation is the minimum
to have (see clisp.org homepage ... better set a -hint attrib to that,
eh?)
(btw konquerer under debian brings an error with www.cons.clisp.org and
a redirect with www.clisp.org to sourceforge).
Hm?
stefan