From: Edi Weitz
Subject: AllegroCL student edition - US$ 99 for two years
Date:
Message-ID: <ur7ltpfgv.fsf@agharta.de>
Not bad - a full, uncrippled version for less than US$ 50 per year:
<http://www.franz.com/downloads/>
Well, not for me...
Edi.
--
Lisp is not dead, it just smells funny.
Real email: (replace (subseq ·········@agharta.de" 5) "edi")
Edi Weitz <········@agharta.de> writes:
> Not bad - a full, uncrippled version for less than US$ 50 per year:
>
> <http://www.franz.com/downloads/>
>
> Well, not for me...
If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
Regards,
--
____________________________
Julian Stecklina / _________________________/
________________/ /
\_________________/ LISP - truly beautiful
Julian Stecklina wrote:
> Edi Weitz <········@agharta.de> writes:
>
>
>>Not bad - a full, uncrippled version for less than US$ 50 per year:
>>
>> <http://www.franz.com/downloads/>
>>
>>Well, not for me...
>
>
> If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
I doubt it.
kenny
--
Cells? Cello? Celtik?: http://www.common-lisp.net/project/cells/
Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film
From: Friedrich Dominicus
Subject: Re: AllegroCL student edition - US$ 99 for two years
Date:
Message-ID: <874qiot43a.fsf@fbigm.here>
Julian Stecklina <··········@web.de> writes:
>
> If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
you can buy it just add this package from here:
http://mcclim.cliki.net/Compatibility
--
Please remove just-for-news- to reply via e-mail.
Friedrich Dominicus wrote:
> Julian Stecklina <··········@web.de> writes:
>
>
>>If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
>
> you can buy it just add this package from here:
> http://mcclim.cliki.net/Compatibility
I was going to say.
So, will the new CLisp MOP support suffice to support McClim? The new
(?) FFI capabilities have me thinking it could handle Cello pretty easily.
kt
--
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Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> So, will the new CLisp MOP support suffice to support McClim? The new
One year ago I posted to the McCLIM mailing list a query about the
possibility of McCLIM of working with CLIM. Here is the reply by Tim
Moore, which I repost here because the list was not archived at the
time.
Paolo
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Timothy Moore
Subject: Re: Can McCLIM work with CLISP?
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2003 22:19:11 +0100
On Dec 8, 2003, at 11:43 AM, Paolo Amoroso wrote:
> There has been a recent discussion in the clisp-list mailing list (I
> hope it's acceptable to Cc: clisp-list) about the possibility of
> making McCLIM work with CLISP. I told there my experience with early
> versions of McCLIM, and I have been asked what would be involved in
> making it work again with CLISP.
>
...
> McCLIM stopped working with CLISP when presentations were added. At
> the time, the use of metaclasses was mentioned in the context of
> presentations, and I assumed that actual CLOS MOP metaclasses were
> used to implement them. But a superficial inspection of the code shows
> that some sort of custom metaclass mechanism is used instead.
No, we use as much of the MOP as we can. The catch is that McCLIM has
to do a lot of work at compile time before the metaclasses are
available, so the mixin that is a superclass of the presentation type
metaclass is also used standalone at compile time.
Another thing that confuses the issue is that the describe function
and the Listener app use the MOP too, and there is support for them in
the Lisp-dep files, but those are demos and not necessary to get the
core bits of McCLIM running. Of course, they are nice to have.
You can grep for clim-mop in the sources and see all the uses of the
MOP. The highlights for the presentation type system are:
Ability to define subclasses (metaclasses) of standard-class and
standard-generic-function and instantiate classes of those metaclasses
class-prototype
class-precedence-list
class-direct-superclasses
ensure-class
method-specializers
eql-specializer
eql-specializer-object
specialization of compute-applicable-methods-using-classes,
compute-applicable-methods
generic-function-methods
extract-specializer-names
extract-lambda-list
>
> Since I am not familiar with the internals of McCLIM, I'd like to ask
> how much effort would be needed to make it work again with CLISP, and
> what are the most probable sources of incompatibility.
See above :) We of course make heavy use of Gray streams; I don't know
what the status of that is in CLISP. Also, at one time nested
backquote didn't work in CLISP, though I suppose that is ancient
history.
>
> Besides the above mentioned problem related to presentations, the
> issue of CLIM-style multiproccesing, which CLISP does not provide yet,
> comes to mind. I have been asked what kind of multiprocessing support
> is required for running McCLIM: fork, threads, pvm, mpi?
>
Lispm style processes, which are really threads. McCLIM also works in
a non-threaded mode which only allows one application to run at a time.
Hope this helps,
Tim
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film
Recommended Common Lisp libraries/tools (see also http://clrfi.alu.org):
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- CL-PPCRE: regular expressions
- UFFI: Foreign Function Interface
From: Bruno Haible
Subject: Re: McCLIM and CLISP [was: Re: AllegroCL student edition - US$ 99 for two years]
Date:
Message-ID: <cppujs$5rn$1@laposte.ilog.fr>
Timothy Moore wrote:
> You can grep for clim-mop in the sources and see all the uses of the
> MOP. The highlights for the presentation type system are:
>
> Ability to define subclasses (metaclasses) of standard-class and
> standard-generic-function and instantiate classes of those metaclasses
> class-prototype
> class-precedence-list
> class-direct-superclasses
> ensure-class
> method-specializers
> eql-specializer
> eql-specializer-object
> specialization of compute-applicable-methods-using-classes,
> compute-applicable-methods
> generic-function-methods
> extract-specializer-names
> extract-lambda-list
CLISP 2.33.80 supports all this.
> We of course make heavy use of Gray streams; I don't know
> what the status of that is in CLISP.
Implemented and documented, with extensions.
Bruno
From: Edi Weitz
Subject: Re: AllegroCL student edition - US$ 99 for two years
Date:
Message-ID: <ufz28m1c3.fsf@agharta.de>
On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 03:13:50 +0100, Julian Stecklina <··········@web.de> wrote:
> If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
You'd probably find another reason why it's still too expensive for
you.
Edi.
--
Lisp is not dead, it just smells funny.
Real email: (replace (subseq ·········@agharta.de" 5) "edi")
Edi Weitz <········@agharta.de> writes:
> On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 03:13:50 +0100, Julian Stecklina <··········@web.de> wrote:
>
> > If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
>
> You'd probably find another reason why it's still too expensive for
> you.
My silly excuse: I am not a student.
I don't seem to recall any combination of two textbooks I had
(purchased new) that cost less than $100 USD. Mind you, they didn't
expire in two years either.
Still, I think Franz is doing a good thing here. I hope it works for
them as a means to promote their product.
--
An ideal world is left as an excercise to the reader.
--- Paul Graham, On Lisp 8.1
Edi Weitz <········@agharta.de> writes:
> On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 03:13:50 +0100, Julian Stecklina <··········@web.de> wrote:
>
>> If it had CLIM, I would buy it.
>
> You'd probably find another reason why it's still too expensive for
> you.
99 $ are about 74 EUR. This is a really fair price. But without CLIM
the gain would be minimal in comparison to SBCL or CMUCL on
FreeBSD. (Btw, I regularly use three operating systems and this
license would allow me to use ACL on only one of them...)
Regards,
--
____________________________
Julian Stecklina / _________________________/
________________/ /
\_________________/ LISP - truly beautiful