Question:
Is there a functional implementation (interface) to OpenGL from Lisp?
I'm trying to do some OpenGL stuff and I could do it in half the time if
I could do it in Lisp.
I've got a dual-boot machine (RH 9 and WinXP Pro) and I don't care which
platform I end up using.
I don't really have any preference in lisps except that I can't afford a
commercial one and the Franz trial's heap limit is going to get in my
way so that doesn't work for me.
I've tried CL-SDL and I can get it to work in Windows with the Franz
demo but that's don't going to help (heap). CLISP in windows doesn't
like something about asdf, I think.
In Linux, something is broken with libGL and TLS so CMUCL can't quite
compile CL-SDL.
I'm open to suggestions for any windowing/OpenGL system. I'd like
something that supports extensions about I'll take what I can get at
this point.
Help Me!
Jason Sewall wrote:
> Question:
>
> I don't really have any preference in lisps except that I can't afford a
> commercial one and the Franz trial's heap limit is going to get in my
> way so that doesn't work for me.
The Lispworks crippling is, well, less crippling. That runs my OpenGL
framework, but ACL's trial won't. But I don't know how far "in my way"
goes, so mebbe LW won't hunt for you either?
Ooops, come to think of it, I hear LW offers LW support out of the box.
>
> I've tried CL-SDL and I can get it to work in Windows with the Franz
> demo but that's don't going to help (heap). CLISP in windows doesn't
> like something about asdf, I think.
Can you tweak ASDF to work? You get the source. I am just guessing at
your expertise, but it sounds like you are comfy with Lisp.
>
> In Linux, something is broken with libGL and TLS so CMUCL can't quite
> compile CL-SDL.
>
> I'm open to suggestions for any windowing/OpenGL system. I'd like
> something that supports extensions about I'll take what I can get at
> this point.
>
> Help Me!
>
How's the McClim OpenGL backend doing these days? Wanna buy a Mac? I
hear tell of MCL+OpenGL stuff, OpenMCL, methinks. Jes' thinkin' out loud.
kenny
--
http://tilton-technology.com
Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film
Your Project Here! http://alu.cliki.net/Industry%20Application
On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 06:36:25 GMT, Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
> Ooops, come to think of it, I hear LW offers LW support out of the
> box.
Certainly. I hear they even support OpenGL out of the box... :)
Edi.
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> How's the McClim OpenGL backend doing these days? Wanna buy a Mac? I
> hear tell of MCL+OpenGL stuff, OpenMCL, methinks. Jes' thinkin' out loud.
Commercial MCL has a contrib that's a wrapper for Apple's OpenGL
library, which works on Mac OS >= 8. Don't know how difficult it
would be to port to OpenMCL.
--
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,--' _,' | Wage class war! |
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`. )----'
Thanks all,
I'm okay with Lisp, but not so good with the details of implementations,
etc.
At any rate, I'm not going to go out and buy a mac (if I wanted software
OpenGL, I could use Mesa). Nothing personal, I can't afford it. Xlib +
OpenGL sounds okay. I'll probably try Lispworks, too. I looked at CLIM
and I don't know if OpenGL works or not.
There are also some nameless OpenGL bindings in CLiki - I wonder if
those work?
I need a big heap because I'm do some research in mesh parameterization
and there are probably going to be some stack-heavy dfses in there.
Also, I'll probably working with some big models, so I'm not confident
that the heap-limited commercial implementations will do it for me.
That's too bad, because they are really nice.
I'll let you know how it goes.
Jason
Jason Sewall wrote:
>
> Thanks all,
>
> I'm okay with Lisp, but not so good with the details of implementations,
> etc.
>
> At any rate, I'm not going to go out and buy a mac (if I wanted software
> OpenGL, I could use Mesa).
just to be clear, the implication mac -> software opengl is not necessarily
true. the degree of hardware accelleartion depends on os version and display
hardware. don't let that misconception guide your decision.
...
Okay, I know what you mean. Macs have many great options for hardware
acceleration (ATI is particularly popular with Apple, if I'm not
mistaken). What I meant was that Apple's OpenGL implementation is
software (Which could be wrong), just like Microsoft's and Mesa.
Jason
james anderson wrote:
>
> Jason Sewall wrote:
>
>>Thanks all,
>>
>>I'm okay with Lisp, but not so good with the details of implementations,
>>etc.
>>
>>At any rate, I'm not going to go out and buy a mac (if I wanted software
>>OpenGL, I could use Mesa).
>
>
> just to be clear, the implication mac -> software opengl is not necessarily
> true. the degree of hardware accelleartion depends on os version and display
> hardware. don't let that misconception guide your decision.
>
> ...
In article <··············@corp.supernews.com>,
Jason Sewall <··@me.com> wrote:
> Okay, I know what you mean. Macs have many great options for hardware
> acceleration (ATI is particularly popular with Apple, if I'm not
> mistaken). What I meant was that Apple's OpenGL implementation is
> software (Which could be wrong), just like Microsoft's and Mesa.
All recent Macs come with either GeForce or Radeon graphics cards that
are fully-supported by the operating system OpenGL libraries.
Some folk around here sell a very OpenGL-intensive weather animation
system to television stations. Though they deploy their software on
Linux I think almost all the programmers use Macs -- certainly one of
them just moved from a dual 1.4 GHz G4 to a dual 2.0 GHz G5, which he is
very happy with.
They're using C++ for the product rather than Lisp (or anything else).
But I happen to know that there have been recent experiements with
programming OpenGL from at least Ruby and Gwydion Dylan (which comes
with OpenGL bindings and some examples).
-- Bruce
Jason Sewall wrote:
> Thanks all,
>
> I'm okay with Lisp, but not so good with the details of implementations,
> etc.
>
> At any rate, I'm not going to go out and buy a mac (if I wanted software
> OpenGL, I could use Mesa). Nothing personal, I can't afford it. Xlib +
> OpenGL sounds okay. I'll probably try Lispworks, too. I looked at CLIM
> and I don't know if OpenGL works or not.
I've used the personal edition of Lispworks with opengl and capi (their
windowing/widget interface) on both windows and linux. It works fine
and comes with opengl and some example programs. That would be the
easiest alternative if you can live within the heap size limitation.
> There are also some nameless OpenGL bindings in CLiki - I wonder if
> those work?
I think that's where I got the ones I use from.
> I need a big heap because I'm do some research in mesh parameterization
> and there are probably going to be some stack-heavy dfses in there.
> Also, I'll probably working with some big models, so I'm not confident
> that the heap-limited commercial implementations will do it for me.
> That's too bad, because they are really nice.
How many polygons in your models? Loading/displaying several models of
10K to 20K polygons or so worked fine for me (in the heap-limited version
of Lispworks). I found that texture maps caused more problems with the memory
limitation than the number polygons. But it all depends, of course, on the exact sizes.
Good luck with it!
Jason Sewall writes:
> OpenGL sounds okay. I'll probably try Lispworks, too. I looked at CLIM
> and I don't know if OpenGL works or not.
From the release notes of McCLIM 0.9:
The OpenGL backend hasn't been tested recently.
> There are also some nameless OpenGL bindings in CLiki - I wonder if
> those work?
A while back I tested one--can't remember which one--and it did work.
Paolo
--
Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film
if you would be able to use a mac there is an interface to apple's opengl implementation.
Jason Sewall wrote:
>
> Question:
>
> Is there a functional implementation (interface) to OpenGL from Lisp?
>
Jason Sewall wrote:
>
> In Linux, something is broken with libGL and TLS so CMUCL can't quite
> compile CL-SDL.
Are you using an ATI card with the latest version of ATI's own linux
drivers? If so, then putting Option "UseFastTLS" "0" in your XF86Config-4
Device section might help.
Alternatively, if you are using an nVidia card, I know there's also
hairy problems with nivdia thread-local-storage and some fairly new glibcs
there too, but I don't know what to do about them nor do I understand them.
········································@lists.debian.org/msg07105.html
I use opengl and xlib on cmucl-18e on Redhat 8.1 (with an
nvidia card). It works fine.
I haven't tried SDL.
Jason Sewall wrote:
> Question:
>
> Is there a functional implementation (interface) to OpenGL from Lisp?
>
> I'm trying to do some OpenGL stuff and I could do it in half the time if
> I could do it in Lisp.
>
> I've got a dual-boot machine (RH 9 and WinXP Pro) and I don't care which
> platform I end up using.
>
> I don't really have any preference in lisps except that I can't afford a
> commercial one and the Franz trial's heap limit is going to get in my
> way so that doesn't work for me.
>
> I've tried CL-SDL and I can get it to work in Windows with the Franz
> demo but that's don't going to help (heap). CLISP in windows doesn't
> like something about asdf, I think.
>
> In Linux, something is broken with libGL and TLS so CMUCL can't quite
> compile CL-SDL.
>
> I'm open to suggestions for any windowing/OpenGL system. I'd like
> something that supports extensions about I'll take what I can get at
> this point.
>
> Help Me!
Jason Sewall wrote:
> Question:
>
> Is there a functional implementation (interface) to OpenGL from Lisp?
>
> I don't really have any preference in lisps except that I can't
afford a
> commercial one and the Franz trial's heap limit is going to get in my
> way so that doesn't work for me.
>
I have implemented the FFI bindings between Corman Lisp (version 2) and
SDL (version 1.2.5). OpenGL seems to work quite well.
http://www.balooga.com/lisp_sdl.php3
-Luke
Luke J Crook wrote:
> Jason Sewall wrote:
>
>> Question:
>>
>> Is there a functional implementation (interface) to OpenGL from Lisp?
>>
> > I don't really have any preference in lisps except that I can't afford a
>
>> commercial one and the Franz trial's heap limit is going to get in my
>> way so that doesn't work for me.
>>
>
> I have implemented the FFI bindings between Corman Lisp (version 2) and
> SDL (version 1.2.5). OpenGL seems to work quite well.
>
> http://www.balooga.com/lisp_sdl.php3
>
> -Luke
>
That's cool, but I don't want to pay for my lisp when great ones like
CMUCL are free.
Thanks anyway.