From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE4EFF3.6010508@nyc.rr.com>
Given that it has heretofore been impossible to get me to shut up about
Cells, this misinterpretation of the fact that I will indeed be hogging
the microphone for a few moments on Tuesday is entirely understandable.
The agenda for tomorrow night in fact will be:
- kenny Tilton with a fun, preaching-to-the-choir "BL on CL, or Why
Bruce Lee would have liked Common Lisp".
- Heow Eide-Goodman will speak on "Hey, Let's Get Going On Our RoboCup
Entry" <title by kenny>
kenny
·········@lxny.org wrote:
> Last month Lisp NYC learned from T. F. Burdick how Lisp is already
helping
> to more rigorously check the safety of parts of OS X. This month
> Kenny Tilton will give an introduction to the Tilton System of Cellular
> Automation. At present TSCA cells are mostly used to automate
> human-machine IO systems, but cells implement a general communication
> discipline often critical in the management of code that might otherwise
> degenerate to a mass of spaghetti control pass-offs.
>
> Official Lisp NYC announcement below.
>
> Jay Sulzberger <·········@lxny.org>
> Corresponding Secretary LXNY
> LXNY is New York's Free Computing Organization.
> http://www.lxny.org
>
>
> <blockquote
> from="official Lisp NYC announcement"
> edit-level="only some header lines suppressed">
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> To: ·····@lispnyc.org" <····@lispnyc.org>
> Subject: [Lisp] Meeting announcement for 10 June 2003
>
> It is my pleasure to announce our meeting at "Time Out" on
June/10/2003 at
> 7pm. The meeting will run for about an hour and then we will go to the
> bar. It is down stairs.
>
> Here are the directions:
>
> The deets:
>
> Name: Time Out
> Location: Amsterdam between 76th and 77th, east side of street, between
> River (Vietnamese and also good food) and another bar/restaurant (name
> forgotten, also good food,drink).
> getting there:
>
> -- by car, 79th street exit from west side highway, down west end ave or
> broadway to 76th, turn left and one or two blocks to Amsterdam.
>
> -- by subway, 1-2-3-9 (the red line) to 72nd or 79th and Broadway. From
> 72nd, walk up Amsterdam (not Broadway). Amsterdam and Broadway cross at
> 72nd. From 79th, walk east one long block to Amsterdam and turn
right/south.
>
> </blockquote>
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Anton van Straaten
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <tV8Fa.42635$Io.3734049@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
Kenny Tilton wrote:
> Given that it has heretofore been impossible to get me to shut up about
> Cells, this misinterpretation of the fact that I will indeed be hogging
> the microphone for a few moments on Tuesday is entirely understandable.
>
> The agenda for tomorrow night in fact will be:
>
> - kenny Tilton with a fun, preaching-to-the-choir "BL on CL, or Why
> Bruce Lee would have liked Common Lisp".
Hmm, I'm tempted to show up, if only to heckle: it seems pretty obvious that
Bruce Lee would have liked Scheme better! Let's examine some Bruce Lee
quotes:
"True refinement seeks simplicity"
"Absorb what is useful, discard what is not"
"Hack away the unessential"
Well, I guess that's settled!
Anton
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE52C37.6040409@nyc.rr.com>
Anton van Straaten wrote:
> Kenny Tilton wrote:
>
>>Given that it has heretofore been impossible to get me to shut up about
>>Cells, this misinterpretation of the fact that I will indeed be hogging
>>the microphone for a few moments on Tuesday is entirely understandable.
>>
>>The agenda for tomorrow night in fact will be:
>>
>>- kenny Tilton with a fun, preaching-to-the-choir "BL on CL, or Why
>>Bruce Lee would have liked Common Lisp".
>
>
> Hmm, I'm tempted to show up, if only to heckle: it seems pretty obvious that
> Bruce Lee would have liked Scheme better! Let's examine some Bruce Lee
> quotes:
>
> "True refinement seeks simplicity"
> "Absorb what is useful, discard what is not"
> "Hack away the unessential"
>
> Well, I guess that's settled!
I believe this is the scene in Annie Hall where I bring in Bruce Lee who
says, "You understand nothing of my work." <g>
I won't spoil my talk by giving away the ending, but I'll post the
correct quotations on Wednesday. For now...
> "True refinement seeks simplicity"
ahhh, but as Einstein said, as simple as possible, but no more. Scheme
is more simple than possible. :)
> "Absorb what is useful, discard what is not"
What in CL is not useful? :)
> "Hack away the unessential"
What in CL is not essential? (But first, define "essential".) :)
<g>
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE55D23.9070403@nyc.rr.com>
Aw, whatthehell....
Kenny Tilton wrote:
>
>
> Anton van Straaten wrote:
>
>> Kenny Tilton wrote:
>>
>>> The agenda for tomorrow night in fact will be:
>>>
>>> - kenny Tilton with a fun, preaching-to-the-choir "BL on CL, or Why
>>> Bruce Lee would have liked Common Lisp".
>>
>> Hmm, I'm tempted to show up, if only to heckle: it seems pretty
>> obvious that
>> Bruce Lee would have liked Scheme better!
Bzzt! (All quotes from Bruce Lee's "The Tao of Jeet Kune Do")
"I hope martial artists are more interested in the root of martial arts
and not the different decorative branches, flowers or leaves. It is
futile to argue as to which single leaf, which design of branches or
which attractive flowers you like; when you understand the root, you
understand all its blossoming."
"If you want to understand the truth in martial arts, to see any
opponent clearly, you must throw away the notion of styles or schools,
prejudices, likes or dislikes, and so forth. Then your mind will cease
all conflict and come to rest. In this silence, you will see totally and
freshly."
>> Let's examine some Bruce Lee
>> quotes:
>>
>> "True refinement seeks simplicity"
>> "Absorb what is useful, discard what is not"
>> "Hack away the unessential"
"Jeet Kune Do favors formlessness so that it can assume all forms and,
since it has no style, Jeet Kune Do fits in with all styles. As a
result, Jeet Kune Do uses all ways and is bound by none and, likewise,
uses any technique or means which serves its end. In this art,
efficiency is anything that scores."
>>
>> Well, I guess that's settled!
>
"Please do not be concerned with soft versus firm, kicking versus
striking, grappling versus hitting and kicking, long-range fighting
versus in-fighting. There is no such thing as 'this' is better than
'that.' Should there be one thing we must guard against, let it be
partiality that robs us of our pristine wholeness and makes us lose
unity in the midst of duality."
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Anton van Straaten
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <nceFa.38704$rO.3641992@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
Kenny Tilton wrote:
> Aw, whatthehell....
Ha! No discipline! You have much to learn...
> "I hope martial artists are more interested in the root of martial arts
> and not the different decorative branches, flowers or leaves. It is
> futile to argue as to which single leaf, which design of branches or
> which attractive flowers you like; when you understand the root, you
> understand all its blossoming."
Clearly, Bruce is talking about the lambda calculus. Score one for Scheme!
> "If you want to understand the truth in martial arts, to see any
> opponent clearly, you must throw away the notion of styles or schools,
> prejudices, likes or dislikes, and so forth. Then your mind will cease
> all conflict and come to rest. In this silence, you will see totally and
> freshly."
Amazing! Having thrown away all prejudices, likes or dislikes, and so
forth, I finally understand Perl!
> "Jeet Kune Do favors formlessness so that it can assume all forms and,
> since it has no style, Jeet Kune Do fits in with all styles. As a
> result, Jeet Kune Do uses all ways and is bound by none and, likewise,
> uses any technique or means which serves its end. In this art,
> efficiency is anything that scores."
Oooh. You got me! I reel back onto the ropes....
> "Please do not be concerned with soft versus firm, kicking versus
> striking, grappling versus hitting and kicking, long-range fighting
> versus in-fighting. There is no such thing as 'this' is better than
> 'that.' Should there be one thing we must guard against, let it be
> partiality that robs us of our pristine wholeness and makes us lose
> unity in the midst of duality."
...but I bounce back, reinvigorated by "unity in the midst of duality" - so
Bruce is saying that Scheme *is* a dialect of Lisp, after all!
> "Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
"Scheme: Because everything is a function." -- Me
Anton
P.S. Better brush up on that Jeet Kune Do, I plan to be there. One Scheme
guy against dozens of Lisp guys, that oughta be an even match, right?
P.P.S. Sheesh! What's wrong with me? Do I have some kind of death wish?
Have I mentioned how great I think Lisp is? Really!!
From: Neil W. Van Dyke
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <nty9096fw6.fsf@neilvandyke.org>
"Anton van Straaten" <·····@appsolutions.com> writes:
> ...but I bounce back, reinvigorated by "unity in the midst of duality" - so
> Bruce is saying that Scheme *is* a dialect of Lisp, after all!
Yet Bruce expresses a preference for Lisp-1 unified namespace.
> One Scheme guy against dozens of Lisp guys, that oughta be an even match,
> right?
As seen in "Enter The Dragon," after small, wiry Bruce made compelling
arguments with a CL-sized Bolo.
(OT: More recently, Bolo faced upstart Java stylist Andries van Dam:
http://www.firstuniversal.clara.net/bolo_files/bolovsjcvd.jpg )
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE614F6.4020908@nyc.rr.com>
Neil W. Van Dyke wrote:
> "Anton van Straaten" <·····@appsolutions.com> writes:
>
>>...but I bounce back, reinvigorated by "unity in the midst of duality" - so
>>Bruce is saying that Scheme *is* a dialect of Lisp, after all!
>
>
> Yet Bruce expresses a preference for Lisp-1 unified namespace.
"To see a thing uncolored by one's own personal preferences and desires
is to see it in its own pristine simplicity."
>
>
>>One Scheme guy against dozens of Lisp guys, that oughta be an even match,
>>right?
>
>
> As seen in "Enter The Dragon," after small, wiry Bruce made compelling
> arguments with a CL-sized Bolo.
One against many would be the cavern scene. And it was a no-school Roper
who conquered the one-tool Bolo with a bite to the leg, stiff jabs, a
hook and a final kick to the groin. Nice variety, eh?
Bruce deconstructed O'Hara and Han. Perhaps you should check your DVD's
continuation button?
:)
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Neil W. Van Dyke
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <jrhe6xwtj3.fsf@neilvandyke.org>
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> Bruce deconstructed O'Hara and Han. Perhaps you should check your DVD's
> continuation button?
Mea culpa. Guess I made a tail position of myself.
From: Joe Marshall
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <wuft4pkx.fsf@ccs.neu.edu>
Neil W. Van Dyke <····@neilvandyke.org> writes:
> Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> > Bruce deconstructed O'Hara and Han. Perhaps you should check your DVD's
> > continuation button?
>
> Mea culpa. Guess I made a tail position of myself.
That'll teach you to JUMP to conclusions.
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE61061.8040903@nyc.rr.com>
Anton van Straaten wrote:
> Kenny Tilton wrote:
>
>>Aw, whatthehell....
>
>
> Ha! No discipline! You have much to learn...
"Understanding requires not just a moment of perception, but a
continuous awareness, a continuous state of inquiry without conclusion."
>
>
>>"I hope martial artists are more interested in the root of martial arts
>>and not the different decorative branches, flowers or leaves. It is
>>futile to argue as to which single leaf, which design of branches or
>>which attractive flowers you like; when you understand the root, you
>>understand all its blossoming."
>
>
> Clearly, Bruce is talking about the lambda calculus. Score one for Scheme!
Is Scheme a leaf, branch, or flower?
>
>
>>"If you want to understand the truth in martial arts, to see any
>>opponent clearly, you must throw away the notion of styles or schools,
>>prejudices, likes or dislikes, and so forth. Then your mind will cease
>>all conflict and come to rest. In this silence, you will see totally and
>>freshly."
>
>
> Amazing! Having thrown away all prejudices, likes or dislikes, and so
> forth, I finally understand Perl!
"The perfect way is only difficult for those who pick and choose. Do not
like, do not dislike; all will then be clear."
Somehow your brilliant arguments now have you challenging the source you
once cited. Reload?
"Give up thinking as though not giving it up."
As for Perl, hey, they just added multi-methods and macros. Gotta make
room for another, um, flower on this tree.
>
>
>>"Jeet Kune Do favors formlessness so that it can assume all forms and,
>>since it has no style, Jeet Kune Do fits in with all styles. As a
>>result, Jeet Kune Do uses all ways and is bound by none and, likewise,
>>uses any technique or means which serves its end. In this art,
>>efficiency is anything that scores."
>
>
> Oooh. You got me! I reel back onto the ropes....
>
>
>>"Please do not be concerned with soft versus firm, kicking versus
>>striking, grappling versus hitting and kicking, long-range fighting
>>versus in-fighting. There is no such thing as 'this' is better than
>>'that.' Should there be one thing we must guard against, let it be
>>partiality that robs us of our pristine wholeness and makes us lose
>>unity in the midst of duality."
>
>
> ...but I bounce back, reinvigorated by "unity in the midst of duality" - so
> Bruce is saying that Scheme *is* a dialect of Lisp, after all!
Sorry, was that in doubt?
> P.S. Better brush up on that Jeet Kune Do, I plan to be there. One Scheme
> guy against dozens of Lisp guys, that oughta be an even match, right?
Win without fighting, grasshopper.
The good news is that tho the name is lisp-nyc, the un-charter welcomes
all who love programming. That said, those who enjoy dynamic,
functional, and reflective languages will find the climate especially
supportive.
>
> P.P.S. Sheesh! What's wrong with me? Do I have some kind of death wish?
> Have I mentioned how great I think Lisp is? Really!!
"Do not run away; let go."
Actually, I need someone to play the part of Bruce Lee tonight. Can you
read aloud well?
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Anton van Straaten
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <TXoFa.43752$Io.3827866@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
Kenny Tilton wrote:
> >>"I hope martial artists are more interested in the root of martial arts
> >>and not the different decorative branches, flowers or leaves. It is
> >>futile to argue as to which single leaf, which design of branches or
> >>which attractive flowers you like; when you understand the root, you
> >>understand all its blossoming."
> >
> >
> > Clearly, Bruce is talking about the lambda calculus. Score one for
Scheme!
>
> Is Scheme a leaf, branch, or flower?
Given that lambda calculus is the root of which Bruce speaks, Scheme is an
expression in the material world of that root. As for Common Lisp... I
think we're talking baobab tree, or maybe banyan.
> "Give up thinking as though not giving it up."
What a coincidence, that's exactly how I give up most things that I haven't
given up! My head hurts... As Keanu/Neo would say, "Whoa!"
> > ...but I bounce back, reinvigorated by "unity in the midst of duality" -
so
> > Bruce is saying that Scheme *is* a dialect of Lisp, after all!
>
> Sorry, was that in doubt?
It depends which Norwegian you ask....
But Neil Van Dyke showed the true meaning of "unity in the midst of
duality": Bruce Lee considers Lisp-1 to be the embodiment of enlightenment.
To perceive truth, you must look past the duality of Lisp-2...
> Win without fighting, grasshopper.
I'll drink to that!
> Actually, I need someone to play the part of Bruce Lee tonight. Can you
> read aloud well?
Yes, although in a South African English accent moderated by some years of
learning to mispronounce letters like "t" as "d" (no, no, please don't
"congradulate" me!)
But this feels like a trap: you want me to participate in Bruce Lee's
alleged endorsement of Common Lisp? How about making that just "Lisp", and
I'm on board. After all, aside from Scheme, I'm sure Bruce wouldn't have
wanted to exclude things like Gregory Chaitin's Lisp implementations, used
in his computable proofs of Goedel's and Turing's theorems. We should be
"interested in the root ... and not the different decorative branches,
flowers or leaves", right?
Anton
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE64A18.7090404@nyc.rr.com>
Anton van Straaten wrote:
> Kenny Tilton wrote:
>>Actually, I need someone to play the part of Bruce Lee tonight. Can you
>>read aloud well?
>
>
> Yes, although in a South African English accent...
Sounds perfect, but...
>
> But this feels like a trap: you want me to participate in Bruce Lee's
> alleged endorsement of Common Lisp? How about making that just "Lisp", and
> I'm on board.
You actors are all alike, you can never just read a script the way it is
written. :)
I'm no Scheme expert, but I think most of what Bruce endorses goes to
the common root, and the conversation /is/ about "Lisp". But I am afraid
there is a question about CL being a ball of mud, and you would have to
send yourself into the ropes with you-know-which quotation.
Never mind, Spitzer will do it. I had not thought of it, but that was in
effect a trapping move; you cannot very well be participating and
heckling both.
See you tonight.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Marc Spitzer
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <86vfvd2fig.fsf@bogomips.optonline.net>
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> Anton van Straaten wrote:
> > Kenny Tilton wrote:
> >>Actually, I need someone to play the part of Bruce Lee tonight. Can you
> >>read aloud well?
> > Yes, although in a South African English accent...
>
> Sounds perfect, but...
>
> > But this feels like a trap: you want me to participate in Bruce Lee's
> > alleged endorsement of Common Lisp? How about making that just "Lisp", and
> > I'm on board.
>
> You actors are all alike, you can never just read a script the way it
> is written. :)
>
> I'm no Scheme expert, but I think most of what Bruce endorses goes to
> the common root, and the conversation /is/ about "Lisp". But I am
> afraid there is a question about CL being a ball of mud, and you would
> have to send yourself into the ropes with you-know-which quotation.
>
> Never mind, Spitzer will do it. I had not thought of it, but that was
> in effect a trapping move; you cannot very well be participating and
> heckling both.
I refuse to be taken for granted.
marc
>
> See you tonight.
>
>
> --
>
> kenny tilton
> clinisys, inc
> http://www.tilton-technology.com/
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> "Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Jeff Caldwell
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <vHuFa.3280$Jw6.2351088@news1.news.adelphia.net>
I only just learned that JavaScript can implement the Y-combinator. Does
that mean JavaScript is a graft from the tree? (The XHTML lined up when
I sent it... who knows if if will by the time you get it.)
<?xml verision = "1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd">
<html xmlns = "http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
<head>
<title>The Y-Combinator in JavaScript</title>
<script type="text/javascript">
var Ycombinator =
function (f) {
return function (g) {
return g(g);
}(function (x) {
return f(function () { return x(x); }); })
};
function yfib (n) {
var fib = Ycombinator(function (fg) {
return function (n) {
if(n == 1) {
return 1;
} else if (n == 2) {
return 1;
} else {
return fg()(n-1) + fg()(n-2);
}
}
});
return fib(n);
};
function fact (n) {
return function (f) { return f(f, n, 1); }(function (c, i, a) {
if(i <= 1) {
return a;
} else {
return c(c,i-1,i*a);
}
});
}
document.writeln("<h1>The Y-Combinator in JavaScript</h1>");
document.writeln("<p>View the source of this web page to see");
document.writeln(" the Y-combinator, from lambda calculus,");
document.writeln(" implemented in JavaScript. ");
document.writeln(" This example runs in at least Internet ");
document.writeln(" Explorer 6.0 and Mozilla 1.3.1.</p>");
document.writeln("<p>The Y-combinator is used in this example");
document.writeln(" to calculate a Fibonacci number. The 10th");
document.writeln(" Fibonacci number is: " + yfib(10) + "</p>");
document.writeln("<p>A simpler example on this page calculates");
document.writeln(" factorials. 15! is " + fact(15) + "</p>");
document.writeln("<p>JavaScript written by Jeff Caldwell ");
document.writeln(" from comp.lang.lisp Common Lisp examples. ");
document.writeln(" 2003-06-10</p>");
document.writeln("</body></html>");
</script>
</head>
<body>
</body>
</html>
Kenny Tilton wrote:
...
> As for Perl, hey, they just added multi-methods and macros. Gotta make
> room for another, um, flower on this tree.
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Correction re NYC LOCAL: Tuesday 10 June 2003 Lisp NYC: Kenny Tilton will expound on Alan Kay\'s \"Everything is a cell.\"
Date:
Message-ID: <3EE6A89E.3000406@nyc.rr.com>
Jeff Caldwell wrote:
> I only just learned that JavaScript can implement the Y-combinator. Does
> that mean JavaScript is a graft from the tree?
Hmmm, Google up a CLL thread in which an ILC2002 presenter defended his
talk in which he suggested we all switch to JavaScript because it was
the same as Lisp. (I might be exagerating a little. <g>) The salient bit
begins with a 2002-11-1 post by Mr. Fred Gilham.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay