It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
Comments and feedback welcome.
E.
From: Kenny Tilton
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <3F136F13.4000807@nyc.rr.com>
Erann Gat wrote:
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> Comments and feedback welcome.
That is not an Idiot's Guide. An Idiot's Guide just says:
"Use defvar or defparameter to create specials.
"Always name specials *whatever*. Never name a local variable *local-var*.
"Never use (declare (special ...))
"Now watch this (untested, typed in off the cuff):
(defparameter *dump* :off)
(defun dump (msg)
(when *dump* (print msg)))
(defun work (task)
(dump (format nil "working on ~a" task))
)
(progn
(work 'first)
(let ((*dump* t))
(work 'second))
(work 'third))
"Enjoy."
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
http://www.tilton-technology.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Everything is a cell." -- Alan Kay
From: Nils Goesche
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <lyel0rlxdq.fsf@cartan.de>
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> That is not an Idiot's Guide. An Idiot's Guide just says:
...
> "Now watch this (untested, typed in off the cuff):
>
> (defparameter *dump* :off)
>
> (defun dump (msg)
> (when *dump* (print msg)))
Is ``Idiot's guide�� an ambivalent expression in English? :-)
> "Enjoy."
Indeed. I think that some simple hints like these should suffice to
take any beginner's fears of specials away once and for all.
Regards,
--
Nils G�sche
"Don't ask for whom the <CTRL-G> tolls."
PGP key ID 0x0655CFA0
From: Michael D. Kersey
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <3F14020F.B5484A77@hal-pc.org>
Erann Gat wrote:
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
PDFs are nice for printing and publishing on paper because you can be
sure they will be in the correct layout for the printer. But on the WWW
PDFs are a waste of bandwidth and a nuisance. PDF is an Adobe
proprietary format. PDF has security problems:
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/07/08/2137200&mode=thread&tid=126&tid=172
Please publish an HTML version.
In article <·················@hal-pc.org>, "Michael D. Kersey"
<········@hal-pc.org> wrote:
> Erann Gat wrote:
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
> > http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> PDFs are nice for printing and publishing on paper because you can be
> sure they will be in the correct layout for the printer. But on the WWW
> PDFs are a waste of bandwidth and a nuisance. PDF is an Adobe
> proprietary format.
No, Adobe has released the format into the public domain. That's why
there are lots of third-party PDF tools out there now.
> PDF has security problems:
>
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/07/08/2137200&mode=thread&tid=126&tid=172
No, Adobe Acrobat Reader has security problems. To say that PDF has
security problems is like saying that HTML has security problems because
Internet Explorer has security problems. If the security holes in Acrobat
concern you, use some other PDF reader, or write your own.
> Please publish an HTML version.
What in the world possesses you to think that I would be in the least
inclined to comply with this request? You haven't even offered me so much
as a word of thanks (let alone any tangible compensation) for the work
that I've already done.
E.
From: Michael D. Kersey
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <3F144915.C01C2C16@hal-pc.org>
Erann Gat wrote:
> No, Adobe Acrobat Reader has security problems. To say that PDF has
> security problems is like saying that HTML has security problems because
> Internet Explorer has security problems. If the security holes in Acrobat
> concern you, use some other PDF reader, or write your own.
>
> > Please publish an HTML version.
>
> What in the world possesses you to think that I would be in the least
> inclined to comply with this request? You haven't even offered me so much
> as a word of thanks (let alone any tangible compensation) for the work
> that I've already done.
>
> E.
Thank you for the clarification that the problem is in Adobe Acrobat
reader.
Following Captain Kangaroo's advice, I did use the Magic Word "Please"
and provide an explanation, but that did not work. I haven't read your
document and doubt that I will have the opportunity, so I cannot
honestly use the other Magic Words "Thank you."
Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
Consumption":
http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
I am surprised that people continue to provide documents in PDF even
when they are aware of the problems. Some relevant URLs:
"[VulnWatch] Adobe Acrobat and PDF security: no improvements for 2
years":
http://archives.neohapsis.com/archives/vulnwatch/2003-q3/0011.html
"Adobe Still Ignores Elcomsoft-Discovered Holes":
http://slashdot.org/articles/03/07/08/2137200.shtml?tid=126&tid=172
CERT's list of Adobe Acrobat security problems:
http://search.cert.org/query.html?rq=0&ht=0&qp=&qs=&qc=&pw=100%25&ws=1&la=&qm=0&st=1&nh=25&lk=1&rf=2&oq=&rq=0&si=1&col=xtracert&col=trandedu&col=vulnotes&col=techtips&col=research&col=certadv&col=incnotes&col=secimp&qt=Adobe+Acrobat
In article <·················@hal-pc.org>, "Michael D. Kersey"
<········@hal-pc.org> wrote:
> I haven't read your
> document and doubt that I will have the opportunity
Then why do you care what format it's in?
> Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
> only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
> Consumption":
> http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
Quoting from that very site:
"PDF is great for one thing and one thing only: printing documents. Paper
is superior to computer screens in many ways, and users often prefer to
print documents that are too long to easily read online."
Did it ever occur to you that I might have used PDF intentionally for this
very reason?
E.
From: David Steuber
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <87isq3uw19.fsf@verizon.net>
···@jpl.nasa.gov (Erann Gat) writes:
> > http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
>
> Quoting from that very site:
>
> "PDF is great for one thing and one thing only: printing documents. Paper
> is superior to computer screens in many ways, and users often prefer to
> print documents that are too long to easily read online."
>
> Did it ever occur to you that I might have used PDF intentionally for this
> very reason?
I for one like PDF. It is generaly more compact than the equivilent
PostScript.
I'm not sure what the complaint is about. Now if this was in Word Doc
format instead of PDF, then I could understand the beef.
--
One Editor to rule them all. One Editor to find them,
One Editor to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.
(do ((a 1 b) (b 1 (+ a b))) (nil a) (print a))
On Wed, Jul 16, 2003 at 12:58:59AM +0000, David Steuber wrote:
> I for one like PDF. It is generaly more compact than the equivilent
> PostScript.
Try gzipping the PostScript file. gv will even read gzipped PS.
--
; Matthew Danish <·······@andrew.cmu.edu>
; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org
; Signed or encrypted mail welcome.
; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark."
From: Matthew Danish
Subject: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <20030715212710.GX17568@lain.mapcar.org>
On Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 01:33:57PM -0500, Michael D. Kersey wrote:
> Thank you for the clarification that the problem is in Adobe Acrobat
> reader.
I would not be surprised. It already screws up Type 3 fonts. There are
plenty of free PDF readers, fortunately, even Debian-free.
> Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
> only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
> Consumption":
> http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
I have to object to this. The article is complete bullshit, and is a
collection of falsehoods and subjective opinion.
I happen to like the way PDFs are presented (though I'm more of a PS fan
myself), and I prefer to read papers and books presented as such. HTML
almost always is presented in an inferior manner by WWW browsers. The
text rendered in PDFs is much easier on the eyes and is easy to zoom and
transform.
``PDF lives in its own environment with different commands and menus.''
Good! Different commands for different abilities. Actually I would
like to see some of those abilities in typical web browsing. Perhaps
the Web should've been done with TeX rather than HTML. Anything but
HTML, I say.
``While not as bad as in the past, you're still more likely to crash
users' browsers or computers if you serve them a PDF file rather than an
HTML page.''
I don't have problems. Stop using crappy software.
``You have to wait for the special reader to start before you can see
the content.''
Wow, impatient ;-) Again, merely has to do with software. And long web
pages take a long time to render too.
``Because the PDF file is not a Web page, it doesn't show your standard
navigation bars.''
This is blatantly not true. But I can start to see where this fellow
might be coming from. I think he is trying to argue that your typical
web-page should not be a PDF. But that's not the case in this
particular thread at all. We're talking about papers and books.
``Most PDF files are immense content chunks with no internal
navigation.''
I never saw an HTML file with page numbering. What the
hell is this all about? What sort of advanced navigation options for
HTML are there anyway? Anchors? Give me a break.
``PDF layouts are often optimized for a sheet of paper, which rarely
matches the size of the user's browser window.''
Bye-bye crappy document formats (HTML). Hello nice fonts and vector
graphics. Ever hear of those? Yes, you can scale those PDFs to any
size you want and they still look good. I love that you can scale the
text in a PDF (or PS) file to gargantuan dimensions. Helps my eyes a
great deal.
Now, user complaints:
``It's a pain that I have to download each PDF.''
It's a pain to have to download this HTML page and read this idiot's
complaints.
``I hate Adobe Acrobat. If I bring up PDF, I can't take a section and
copy it and move it to Word.''
That's only because he is a moron. Ever notice the little Text
Selection icon? It's right next to the hand scroll icon.
Either that, or Word is fucking up, as usual. But I don't use Word, so
I wouldn't know.
``What we've got is a page of a PDF document which is great when
printed out, but on the screen it is hard to read. The print is too
small...''
He sounds pretty unsure of himself. Perhaps he should double-check the
zoom button, to make sure it is really right in front of his face.
Seriously, I'm sure this guy could've come up with some legitimate user
complaints. But the ones he posted are so lame they seem to simply
invite ridicule.
> I am surprised that people continue to provide documents in PDF even
> when they are aware of the problems. Some relevant URLs:
> "[VulnWatch] Adobe Acrobat and PDF security: no improvements for 2
> years":
> http://archives.neohapsis.com/archives/vulnwatch/2003-q3/0011.html
Unix: No Security Improvements for 30 years.
Windows: No Security Improvements for 10 years.
IE: No Security Improvements for 5 years.
Acrobat: No Security Improvements for 2 years.
Oh boy... what are we ever going to do? Everything sucks!
--
; Matthew Danish <·······@andrew.cmu.edu>
; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org
; Signed or encrypted mail welcome.
; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark."
From: Will Hartung
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <bf247v$acgpf$1@ID-197644.news.uni-berlin.de>
"Matthew Danish" <·······@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote in message
···························@lain.mapcar.org...
> On Tue, Jul 15, 2003 at 01:33:57PM -0500, Michael D. Kersey wrote:
> > Thank you for the clarification that the problem is in Adobe Acrobat
> > reader.
>
> I would not be surprised. It already screws up Type 3 fonts. There are
> plenty of free PDF readers, fortunately, even Debian-free.
>
> > Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
> > only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
> > Consumption":
> > http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
>
> I have to object to this. The article is complete bullshit, and is a
> collection of falsehoods and subjective opinion.
>
> I happen to like the way PDFs are presented (though I'm more of a PS fan
> myself), and I prefer to read papers and books presented as such. HTML
> almost always is presented in an inferior manner by WWW browsers. The
> text rendered in PDFs is much easier on the eyes and is easy to zoom and
> transform.
In the web environment, I have basically 3 complaints with PDF -- one which
is not PDF's fault, though it is an "enabler", and the other two have to do
with the plugin.
The first complaint is more directed to those PDFs of articles in the
"classic two column journal" format. While the two columns are I think
easier to read on paper, they're just dreadful online in the viewer -- twice
the scrolling, half the information.
Within the browser, the classic Adobe plugin cooperates with modern HTTP
servers in that it only requests pages at a time from the server, rather
than the entire document. Nobel in its effort to reduce bandwidth, it's a
miserable experience for the user as the client freezes as you're scolling
down, particularly against any laggy server. Most of the this is absorbed
behind the scenes for an HTML page that comes down in fits and starts as the
browser (hopefully, depending on how the page is formatted) backfills the
page.
Finally, a nit indeed, the "Ctrl-F" find feature of the browser is not the
"binoculars" find feature of the plug-in...annoying. I tend to use the
plug-in find feature to search for "agasdgasda" so it will download the
entire document for me.
However, if given the choice between 100 pages of HTML and a single PDF,
I'll go with the PDF almost every time, as I can search it and navigate it
easier.
Regards,
Will Hartung
(·····@msoft.com)
From: David Steuber
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <87d6gbuvim.fsf@verizon.net>
"Will Hartung" <·····@msoft.com> writes:
> Finally, a nit indeed, the "Ctrl-F" find feature of the browser is not the
> "binoculars" find feature of the plug-in...annoying. I tend to use the
> plug-in find feature to search for "agasdgasda" so it will download the
> entire document for me.
I almost always simply download the PDF file and use a seperate viewer
rather than the browser plug-in. I almost never use acrobat. The
only times I do are when gv or preview won't properly view the
document for me. That is quite rare.
--
One Editor to rule them all. One Editor to find them,
One Editor to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.
(do ((a 1 b) (b 1 (+ a b))) (nil a) (print a))
From: ··········@YahooGroups.Com
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <REM-2003jul26-006@Yahoo.Com>
{{Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2003 17:27:10 -0400
From: Matthew Danish <·······@andrew.cmu.edu>
There are plenty of free PDF readers, fortunately ... I happen to
like the way PDFs are presented}}
My only access to the net is via a VT100 emulator into a Unix shell
account, and then my only access to the Web is via lynx, a
VT100-text-only Web browser. Do you know of any free PDF reader which
will render a PDF file into VT100 ASCII text, like doing OCR on the
image and having some smarts to lay it out appropriately via
mostly-vanilla text, with two-column output if any linearized into tall
single columns?
Alternately, would anybody hire me to do LISP programming (15 years
experience at LISP, 22 years total programming experience) so that I
can pay the rent and won't become homeless in a few months, and so that
I can pay off $30k of debts on credit cards needed to avoid being
homeless the past five years, and then after all that's paid off, buy a
laptop that can render PDF files in the usual way? The last time I saw
a job ad that was primarily LISP was an embedded-LISP-in-CAD job in
1991, where I interviewed but didn't get the job. The only so-called
LISP programming jobs I've seen in recent years have been (1) C++ Java
jobs where having a little LISP on the side is desired, and jobs that
require a Ph.D. in some obscure field. I do regular application
programming, including WebServer (CGI) applications. Will there *ever*
be LISP programming jobs available?
{{Perhaps the Web should've been done with TeX rather than HTML.}}
Is Te{chi} able to render output as plain ASCII text, using multiple
lines as needed to render mathematical expressions (as MacSYMA nicely
does)?
From: Thomas F. Burdick
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <xcvadb0r2uy.fsf@famine.OCF.Berkeley.EDU>
··········@YahooGroups.Com writes:
> Do you know of any free PDF reader which will render a PDF file into
> VT100 ASCII text, like doing OCR on the image and having some smarts
> to lay it out appropriately via mostly-vanilla text, with two-column
> output if any linearized into tall single columns?
pdftotext. PDF is *not* an image format, it's a page definition language.
--
/|_ .-----------------------.
,' .\ / | No to Imperialist war |
,--' _,' | Wage class war! |
/ / `-----------------------'
( -. |
| ) |
(`-. '--.)
`. )----'
From: ··········@YahooGroups.Com
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to viewing PDFs [was Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)]
Date:
Message-ID: <REM-2003aug01-004@Yahoo.Com>
{{> Do you know of any free PDF reader which will render a PDF file into
> VT100 ASCII text, ...?
Date: 26 Jul 2003 21:49:09 -0700
From: ···@famine.OCF.Berkeley.EDU (Thomas F. Burdick)
pdftotext. PDF is *not* an image format, it's a page definition
language.}}
Hmm, I searched Google, found some man pages that don't say what system
it would run on nor where to find the program, one that said explicitly
it runs only on Microsoft Windows, and one that said it ran on Unix
but:
This version includes a small patch that fixes a security hole in
version 2.02. It was possible to construct a malicious URL link in a
PDF file which would cause an arbitrary command to be run. The patch
changes things to that the various characters which can cause trouble
are escaped (%xx) before calling system().
Why would anybody call system() giving as an argument some text that
occurred in some random PDF document found on the net?? That seems to
be a totally dangerous thing to do, even after escaping some
characters. What is going on here? In any case, there's no version on
my ISP, and given such a dangerous thing going on I don't want to be
the one to download the source and install it and lose my account
because of a security leak I created on my ISP where I have my shell
account.
From: Dorai Sitaram
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <bf1mq1$s7f$1@news.gte.com>
In article <·················@hal-pc.org>,
Michael D. Kersey <········@hal-pc.org> wrote:
>
>Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
>only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
>Consumption":
>http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
I prefer HTML to PDF on the Web too, but Nielsen's
first and foremost reason, "Linear exposition", has it
all wrong. I don't deny there may be some styles of
exposition that are peculiar to the Web, but to dismiss
any chance of a Web presence for a document because it
does "linear exposition" is simply too crazy. Print
documents can and have been intelligently and
faithfully offered on the Web, with print
cross-references appropriately transliterated into Web
links, and without being made to go through a
content mangler and exposition delinearizer.
--
dorai @ ccs . neu . edu
In article <·················@hal-pc.org>,
"Michael D. Kersey" <········@hal-pc.org> wrote:
> Erann Gat wrote:
> > No, Adobe Acrobat Reader has security problems. To say that PDF has
> > security problems is like saying that HTML has security problems because
> > Internet Explorer has security problems. If the security holes in Acrobat
> > concern you, use some other PDF reader, or write your own.
> >
> > > Please publish an HTML version.
> >
> > What in the world possesses you to think that I would be in the least
> > inclined to comply with this request? You haven't even offered me so much
> > as a word of thanks (let alone any tangible compensation) for the work
> > that I've already done.
> >
> > E.
>
> Thank you for the clarification that the problem is in Adobe Acrobat
> reader.
>
> Following Captain Kangaroo's advice, I did use the Magic Word "Please"
> and provide an explanation, but that did not work. I haven't read your
> document and doubt that I will have the opportunity, so I cannot
> honestly use the other Magic Words "Thank you."
Google has a "view as HTML" feature that usually works for pdf.
> Thanks to Eric Hanchrow who read this thread and provided a URL put up
> only yesterday at Jakob Nielsen's site, titled "PDF: Unfit for Human
> Consumption":
> http://useit.com/alertbox/20030714.html
At a first glance, his argument of that author is that pdf is only
suitable for printing documents. What do you think you can do with
Erann's pdf file?
> I am surprised that people continue to provide documents in PDF even
> when they are aware of the problems.
It's the only format I am aware of that works more or less out of the
box on almost any platform. (More often than not, HTML has printing
problems depending on the browser one uses.)
Pascal
From: Nikodemus Siivola
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <bf0tvi$avb$2@nyytiset.pp.htv.fi>
Erann Gat <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
My major quibble is the same as with the guide to packages:
They are not Idiot Guides. They're in-depth explanations.
How about "Demystification of ...", "Secrets of ...", or even
"... Unveiled"?
Cheers,
-- Nikodemus
In article <············@nyytiset.pp.htv.fi>, Nikodemus Siivola
<······@random-state.net> wrote:
> Erann Gat <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> My major quibble is the same as with the guide to packages:
>
> They are not Idiot Guides. They're in-depth explanations.
>
> How about "Demystification of ...", "Secrets of ...", or even
> "... Unveiled"?
See 3160870773012596%40naggum.no and
gat-0203001548330001%40milo.jpl.nasa.gov for the reason for the titles.
E.
Nikodemus Siivola <······@random-state.net> wrote in message news:<············@nyytiset.pp.htv.fi>...
> Erann Gat <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> My major quibble is the same as with the guide to packages:
>
> They are not Idiot Guides... <snipped>
AFAICT the possessive ("Idiot's") in the title refers to the author,
not the readers, since it is of the singular form.
On another note, here is Erik Naggum?
http://www.google.com/groups?q=+%22Erann%22+group:comp.lang.lisp+author:Erik+author:Naggum&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&scoring=r&selm=3227997190323124%40naggum.net&rnum=5
Nikodemus Siivola <······@random-state.net> wrote:
> Erann Gat <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
> My major quibble is the same as with the guide to packages:
> They are not Idiot Guides. They're in-depth explanations.
> How about "Demystification of ...", "Secrets of ...", or even
> "... Unveiled"?
"Idiot's Guide" is fairly common ironic jargon these days for "doesn't
assume you know anything more than enough to have the question." I'm
astounded that so many people do not realize this. If some person said
to you in a conversation where lisp was mentioned, "I'm a complete idiot
where it comes to lisp," would you assume the speaker meant something
closer to:
a) "I have an IQ well below 100, a barely fluent grasp of my native
language and no important mathematical or logical understanding to speak
of, therefore I am pretty much incapable of understanding anything you
say about lisp or any other programming language. In fact, I couldn't
even write this paragraph the way you see it here, because I don't know
the meaning of half the words."
or
b) "I've heard of lisp, am aware that some consider it an awesomely
cool language, but I've never learned the first thing about it beyond
that it requires a lot of parentheses. I might actually be interested in
hearing about it, but you need to realize that while I am reasonably
intelligent and computer literate, I know nothing (except perhaps
misconceptions) about it already."
If you take "complete idiot" literally, you would assume "a)", but
that's pretty unlikely to be correct. No literal "complete idiot" in
that sense would care a whit about special variables or have any clue
how to find Erann's paper.
I think Coby's probably right that some people won't make it all the way
through, and you might as well give those folks the crutch necessary to
avoid 95% of problems within the first few paragraphs. But the name is
not inappropriate given common usage. There are lots of things labeled
"Idiot's guide to X" these days which start from scratch but give lots
of excellent in depth information.
Erann's paper was understandable to me when I first saw just a week or
so after starting with CL, so I think it qualifies as an idiot's guide
in the modern sense.
Michael
From: lin8080
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <3F301B17.1AE62B37@freenet.de>
Michael Sullivan schrieb:
> Nikodemus Siivola <······@random-state.net> wrote:
> > Erann Gat <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> I think Coby's probably right that some people won't make it all the way
> through, ...
> ... which start from scratch but give lots
> of excellent in depth information.
> Erann's paper was understandable to me when I first saw just a week or
> so after starting with CL, so I think it qualifies as an idiot's guide
> in the modern sense.
allow me to describe how i do use most lisp docus:
1. mostly on sunday morning i opened a pdf with detailed infos about
this or that in lisp (some idiot guids are among them, i download this
kind of docus in a seperate /).
2. the more interesting thing is: i know about 50 commands out of my
head, ready for use. i know about 150 or so commands, but for these i
have to take a look to hyperspec or the important impmotes about how to
use them in the correct manner (parameters, keywords..), when i want to
use one of them (and let me say, the most useful thing there is a list
of examples, this is very quick and informative). the rest of the 980
commands i saw once or never (it is mighty to know there is more, but
not to know what exactly it is) and forget it by time, until i read
about (even here in cll).
now, when i sit and think, how to solve this or that with lisp, i try
and try and try. nearly 80% of the code i write down first has changed
until it does what i thought it have to do. and this code most is very
simple, seldom optimized (thanks to the editors copy & paste), but, and
that is the best side for me, it works on cl, openlisp, xlisp and
newlisp, because there is no special command in use (sure, some changes
are always necessary).
for me as a hobby programmer this is right till today. maybe it is
interesting that lisp is the only language, i ever write bigger
programmes and not only homework like listings. it is funny and i love
it. (yes i try java, but i start with java 1.0 and my ping-pong applet
needs to be rewrite, when java 1.1 comes out, so after the 3. rewrite i
said myself: no. and yes, i will not learn c, or c++ (this makes me
think in ways i will not think), and as a student i have to do something
in pascal, but i don't like it).
maybe when there is an other idiot-guide to a relevant theme, (say how
to build package (but there are already some around)) the writer thinks
about the thing, that there are readers like my who look for a quick
overview to decide, whether this is the stuff who describe what i'm
looking for, so lets read the details or search elsewhere.
stefan
ps: can you imagine how i feel, when i first stumbeled into c.l.l?
"Erann Gat" <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote in message
·························@k-137-79-50-101.jpl.nasa.gov...
>
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> Comments and feedback welcome.
>
That's great, Erann! I find it very clear and very well presented. I do
however think it skips a simplistic but never the less very practical first
level. ie: first mention the common newbie faux pas of using setf to
introduce a lexical var and mention the most elegant behaviour of (let
((*special* :foo)) ... )
I think if you start with those very basic but important practical things
then the 75% of the population that will not get past page 2 will still have
learned how to behave even if they did not bother to understand why.
So I guess I am suggesting a very short first section of just the practical
basics. The rest of your article is an excellent explanation for those who
will be interested.
Thanks for taking the time to do that.
--
Coby Beck
(remove #\Space "coby 101 @ big pond . com")
In article <·············@otis.netspace.net.au>, "Coby Beck"
<·····@mercury.bc.ca> wrote:
> "Erann Gat" <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote in message
> ·························@k-137-79-50-101.jpl.nasa.gov...
> >
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
> >
> > http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
> >
> > Comments and feedback welcome.
> >
>
> That's great, Erann! I find it very clear and very well presented. I do
> however think it skips a simplistic but never the less very practical first
> level. ie: first mention the common newbie faux pas of using setf to
> introduce a lexical var and mention the most elegant behaviour of (let
> ((*special* :foo)) ... )
>
> I think if you start with those very basic but important practical things
> then the 75% of the population that will not get past page 2 will still have
> learned how to behave even if they did not bother to understand why.
>
> So I guess I am suggesting a very short first section of just the practical
> basics. The rest of your article is an excellent explanation for those who
> will be interested.
Good idea. I'll add that.
E.
Coby Beck wrote:
> "Erann Gat" <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote in message
> ·························@k-137-79-50-101.jpl.nasa.gov...
>
>>It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
>>Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>>
>>http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>>
>>Comments and feedback welcome.
>>
>
>
> That's great, Erann! I find it very clear and very well presented. I do
> however think it skips a simplistic but never the less very practical first
> level. ie: first mention the common newbie faux pas of using setf to
> introduce a lexical var and mention the most elegant behaviour of (let
> ((*special* :foo)) ... )
>
Hmmm...Happened smth like that to me *last week*, right here on c.l.l.!
Right on!
Actually, I could quote 3 or 4 generally good Common Lisp books that
induce us (newbies) to these mistakes. The only guide that's
crystal-clear in this respect (let) is the CLTL2.
Cheers
Henry
Erann Gat wrote:
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> Comments and feedback welcome.
>
> E.
Hi Erann,
thank you for making this guide. It's very interesting and although I
understood special variables before reading the guide (at least I think
so) it helps to make things even clearer.
Does anybody ynow of something similar for CL's condition system (this
is something that I still haven't understood).
Rolf Wester
From: Nils Goesche
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <lyy8yyk1xc.fsf@cartan.de>
Rolf Wester <······@ilt.fraunhofer.de> writes:
> Does anybody ynow of something similar for CL's condition system
> (this is something that I still haven't understood).
Have you tried
http://www.nhplace.com/kent/Papers/Condition-Handling-2001.html
already?
Regards,
--
Nils G�sche
"Don't ask for whom the <CTRL-G> tolls."
PGP key ID 0x0655CFA0
Nils Goesche wrote:
> Rolf Wester <······@ilt.fraunhofer.de> writes:
>
>
>>Does anybody ynow of something similar for CL's condition system
>>(this is something that I still haven't understood).
>
>
> Have you tried
>
> http://www.nhplace.com/kent/Papers/Condition-Handling-2001.html
>
> already?
>
> Regards,
Thank you.I'm going to read it. I hope it's 'idiotic' enough
for me.
Regards
On Mon, 14 Jul 2003 17:21:14 -0700, ···@jpl.nasa.gov (Erann Gat) wrote:
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> Comments and feedback welcome.
While I can view it, I am unable to print it--and also the guide to
packages. I have tried under Linux and Windows with versions of the Acrobat
reader up to 4.x.
Paolo
--
Paolo Amoroso <·······@mclink.it>
From: Edi Weitz
Subject: Re: Idiot's guide to special variables now available (again)
Date:
Message-ID: <87d6gak0cg.fsf@bird.agharta.de>
Paolo Amoroso <·······@mclink.it> writes:
> > http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> While I can view it, I am unable to print it--and also the guide to
> packages. I have tried under Linux and Windows with versions of the
> Acrobat reader up to 4.x.
Strange. Worked fine for me with a2ps on an old SuSE Linux box. (I
think a2ps delegates to Acrobat Reader.)
Edi.
"Erann Gat" <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote in message
·························@k-137-79-50-101.jpl.nasa.gov...
> It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
>
> http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
>
> Comments and feedback welcome.
>
> E.
Thank you. The article was very useful to me. I've been reading a fair
amount of theoretical stuff, but still was slightly muddled and this article
cleared up the practicalities.
In (very poor) payment for releasing this for free, I've done a little proof
reading: page 6, line 11 (ignoring blank lines), in the form:
"(d-let ((z 2))
(llet ((z 3)) ; Simply referring to...."
"llet" should be "l-let", no?
Unfortunately, I'm not competent to review the content. But, thanks for
helping me.
Alex
In article <·························@mercury.nildram.net>, "Alex Tibbles"
<············@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> "Erann Gat" <···@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote in message
> ·························@k-137-79-50-101.jpl.nasa.gov...
> > It's back by popular demand! :-) The new and improved (hopefully)
> > Idiot's Guide to Special Variables and Lexical Closures is now on-line at:
> >
> > http://www.flownet.com/gat/specials.pdf
> >
> > Comments and feedback welcome.
> >
> > E.
>
> Thank you. The article was very useful to me. I've been reading a fair
> amount of theoretical stuff, but still was slightly muddled and this article
> cleared up the practicalities.
> In (very poor) payment for releasing this for free, I've done a little proof
> reading: page 6, line 11 (ignoring blank lines), in the form:
> "(d-let ((z 2))
> (llet ((z 3)) ; Simply referring to...."
> "llet" should be "l-let", no?
Yes, there are actually a couple of typos like this. I'll be posting a
corrected version shortly.
Thanks for the feedback. It's good to know that people find this useful.
E.