OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
achieved, will be considered "a decent start"? We can define this by
example so we do not get into a feature debate. I am thinking of targets
such as:
- a resume (not much of a challenge)
- a scholarly paper
- an NY Times (mini) front-page
- other: _______________________
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message news:<·················@nyc.rr.com>...
>
> - other: _______________________
Its own documentation & source listing with pages numbered & broken,
comments in italics, say.
--tim
Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>
> Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message news:<·················@nyc.rr.com>...
>
> >
> > - other: _______________________
>
> Its own documentation & source listing with pages numbered & broken,
> comments in italics, say.
>
What documentation? :) As for the source, you don't want me marking up
the source, right? I have to read the source as a text file and parse it
myself?
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
Kenny Tilton wrote:
> OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> achieved, will be considered "a decent start"?
A page from the Babylonian Talmud with many non-rectagular cells filled
from right to left in a non-latin script, see
http://www.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/TalmudPage.html
Yours, Florian.
Florian Hars wrote:
>
> Kenny Tilton wrote:
> > OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> > achieved, will be considered "a decent start"?
>
> A page from the Babylonian Talmud with many non-rectagular cells filled
> from right to left in a non-latin script, see
> http://www.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/TalmudPage.html
>
Wow, fascinating stuff.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
> Florian Hars wrote:
> >
> > Kenny Tilton wrote:
> > > OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> > > achieved, will be considered "a decent start"?
> >
> > A page from the Babylonian Talmud with many non-rectagular cells filled
> > from right to left in a non-latin script, see
> > http://www.ucalgary.ca/~elsegal/TalmudPage.html
> >
>
> Wow, fascinating stuff.
It's trivial stuff. Get any Legal document if you want something
really complex :)
Cheers
--
Marco Antoniotti ========================================================
NYU Courant Bioinformatics Group tel. +1 - 212 - 998 3488
719 Broadway 12th Floor fax +1 - 212 - 995 4122
New York, NY 10003, USA http://bioinformatics.cat.nyu.edu
"Hello New York! We'll do what we can!"
Bill Murray in `Ghostbusters'.
On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 00:41:05 GMT,
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
> OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> achieved, will be considered "a decent start"? We can define this by
> example so we do not get into a feature debate. I am thinking of targets
> such as:
>
> - a resume (not much of a challenge)
a few fonts, a nice layout with different alignments,
intelligent page breaks would do here. In the following
sample I would like the heading to align with the right
column, where text should be block justified. Page breaks
should only occur between blocks, with the option of
keeping the vertical spacing or widening proportionately
to the amount already there.
Resume
Personal Stefan Schmiedl
born: yes ...
Education enough, thanks
>
> - a scholarly paper
be careful there ... you might have to deal with formulas.
Go for technical docs (listings with syntax highlighting)
and sophisticated tables first.
You could take some latex files available on the net
and aim to be as similar as possible.
"Rewrite LaTeX in CL so that I don't have to use \ so often".
s.
--
Stefan Schmiedl
EDV-Beratung, Programmierung, Schulung
Loreleystr. 5, 94315 Straubing, Germany
Tel. (0 94 21) 74 01 06, Fax (0 94 21) 74 01 21
Public Key: http://xss.de/stefan.public
shhhh ... I can't hear my code!
Stefan Schmiedl wrote:
>
> On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 00:41:05 GMT,
> Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
> > OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> > achieved, will be considered "a decent start"? We can define this by
> > example so we do not get into a feature debate. I am thinking of targets
> > such as:
> >
> > - a resume (not much of a challenge)
>
> a few fonts, a nice layout with different alignments,
> intelligent page breaks would do here.
everything but the page breaks is ready to go in the layout and text
engine I have now, I just gotta splice it to CL-PDF.
> >
> > - a scholarly paper
>
> be careful there ... you might have to deal with formulas.
> Go for technical docs (listings with syntax highlighting)
> and sophisticated tables first.
Interesting historical note: cells got invented to manage layout of math
expressions.
Sophisticated tables: done.
Thx for the input
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
Frode Vatvedt Fjeld wrote:
>
> Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> writes:
>
> > OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack?
>
> A slide presentation?
You mean "a little text arranged here and there around various
graphics?" do you want the graphics pulled in as a BMP or be able to
build them programmatically?
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
For me personally, a front page of a newspaper, multiple columns, pictures
(color), multiple fonts, section index. I guess just like your NY Times
suggestion.
How about the CLHS, but in PDF?
Wade
"Kenny Tilton" <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message
······················@nyc.rr.com...
> OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> achieved, will be considered "a decent start"? We can define this by
> example so we do not get into a feature debate. I am thinking of targets
> such as:
>
> - a resume (not much of a challenge)
>
> - a scholarly paper
>
> - an NY Times (mini) front-page
>
> - other: _______________________
>
> --
>
> kenny tilton
> clinisys, inc
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> "Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
> - Ty, Caddy Shack
Wade Humeniuk wrote:
>
> For me personally, a front page of a newspaper, multiple columns, pictures
> (color), multiple fonts, section index. I guess just like your NY Times
> suggestion.
>
Yeah, and if we make it a baseball article we can do the box score,
which will exercise a lot of tabular stuff. I may do a first cut without
justification (left and right both) unless I get energetic; right now we
just have left, right and centered.
What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do they
try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate in v1.0, I
want to focus on layout at first.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
"Kenny Tilton" <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote in message
······················@nyc.rr.com...
>
>
> Wade Humeniuk wrote:
> >
> > For me personally, a front page of a newspaper, multiple columns,
pictures
> > (color), multiple fonts, section index. I guess just like your NY Times
> > suggestion.
> >
>
> Yeah, and if we make it a baseball article we can do the box score,
> which will exercise a lot of tabular stuff. I may do a first cut without
> justification (left and right both) unless I get energetic; right now we
> just have left, right and centered.
>
> What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do they
> try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate in v1.0, I
> want to focus on layout at first.
I would just do it will simple rules first. If it looks bad rewrite the
article so it looks better. I am sure newspapers have to hand proof article
layouts to avoid strange things like that. It is hard to imagine a layout
engine that can take everything into account. There would seem to be to
much aesthetics involved, even though the layout is correct it just might
look awful.
Wade
On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 20:03:33 GMT,
Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do they
> try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate in v1.0, I
> want to focus on layout at first.
>
you might want to look at the latex babel package for this.
they have lots of high quality hyphenation patterns with
"weights" for good and bad hyphenation points. those are
plain text input files one pattern per line for the most
part. and at least in german and english texts they produce
the best automatic hyphenation i have yet seen.
s.
--
Stefan Schmiedl
EDV-Beratung, Programmierung, Schulung
Loreleystr. 5, 94315 Straubing, Germany
Tel. (0 94 21) 74 01 06, Fax (0 94 21) 74 01 21
Public Key: http://xss.de/stefan.public
shhhh ... I can't hear my code!
Stefan Schmiedl wrote:
>
> On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 20:03:33 GMT,
> Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
> >
>
> > What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do they
> > try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate in v1.0, I
> > want to focus on layout at first.
> >
>
> you might want to look at the latex babel package for this.
OK, I'll check it out. I've heard by email that TeX is strong on this
topic.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
+ Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com>:
| Stefan Schmiedl wrote:
| >
| > On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 20:03:33 GMT,
| > Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
| >
| > > What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do
| > > they try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate
| > > in v1.0, I want to focus on layout at first.
| >
| > you might want to look at the latex babel package for this.
|
| OK, I'll check it out. I've heard by email that TeX is strong on
| this topic.
Have a look at Appendix H in Knuth's The TeXbook. Or go back to the
sources and get Frank M Liang's 1983 PhD thesis from Stanford's CS
department. TeX's hyphenation patterns are built from lists of
hyphenated words using a program called patgen, which is part of every
self-respecting TeX installation. Your easiest way out would be just
to use TeX's hyphenation patterns; they are easily parsed, and should
be easy to use as well.
--
* Harald Hanche-Olsen <URL:http://www.math.ntnu.no/~hanche/>
- Yes it works in practice - but does it work in theory?
On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 20:03:33 GMT, Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>Yeah, and if we make it a baseball article we can do the box score,
>which will exercise a lot of tabular stuff. I may do a first cut without
>justification (left and right both) unless I get energetic; right now we
>just have left, right and centered.
>
>What do I do about hyphenation?! Do folks use dictionaries or do they
>try to do it by a set of rules? I might just not hyphenate in v1.0, I
>want to focus on layout at first.
Since hyphenation will be language dependant I think it should be performed by
a user-provided function. Whenever a word needs to be hyphenated, pass it to
that function.
In Romance languages hyphenation should be very easy, almost trivial, but in
English... AFAIK you would need some sort lookup table for English, as there
aren't any rules are there?
----
Fernando Rodr�guez
frr at wanadoo dot es
-------
On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 00:41:05 GMT, Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
> OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
[...]
> - other: _______________________
What about the XML specification? :)
Paolo
--
EncyCMUCLopedia * Extensive collection of CMU Common Lisp documentation
http://www.paoloamoroso.it/ency/README
[http://cvs2.cons.org:8000/cmucl/doc/EncyCMUCLopedia/]
Paolo Amoroso wrote:
>
> On Thu, 14 Mar 2002 00:41:05 GMT, Kenny Tilton <·······@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> [...]
> > - other: _______________________
>
> What about the XML specification? :)
Not a bad idea at all. Looks easy.
--
kenny tilton
clinisys, inc
---------------------------------------------------------------
"Be the ball...be the ball...you're not being the ball, Danny."
- Ty, Caddy Shack
Kenny Tilton schrieb:
> OK, so what is a good test case for a cl-pdf layout hack? ie, what, if
> achieved, will be considered "a decent start"? We can define this by
> example so we do not get into a feature debate. I am thinking of targets
> such as:
> - other: ___C_o_m_i_c___
:)))
stefan