From: James A. Crippen
Subject: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <m3lm9lfeqc.fsf@kappa.unlambda.com>
This is probably not the right forum but I'm going to waste countless
people's bandwidth anyway asking this question...

What's the status of DEFSYSTEM 4 (the CLOS-based replacement for
DEFSYSTEM 3.x)?  How compatible is it with DS 3.2 'Interim' and with
defsystem files that are written for that version?  I'm curious
because I'd like to write a somewhat complicated defsystem that calls
the C compiler for help, but I know that the support for this is
completely ad-hack in DS 3.x.  Also, I'd like to just use the CLOS
based DS 4 and never look back, if I can.  DS3 has grown too klugified
for my tastes...

'james

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James A. Crippen <·····@unlambda.com> ,-./-.  Anchorage, Alaska,
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From: Marco Antoniotti
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <y6cvg8o4kds.fsf@octagon.mrl.nyu.edu>
·····@unlambda.com (James A. Crippen) writes:

> This is probably not the right forum but I'm going to waste countless
> people's bandwidth anyway asking this question...
> 
> What's the status of DEFSYSTEM 4 (the CLOS-based replacement for
> DEFSYSTEM 3.x)?  How compatible is it with DS 3.2 'Interim' and with
> defsystem files that are written for that version? 

Official answer.  MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x specs are (so far)  upward
compatible with MK:DEFSYSTEM 4.x.

> I'm curious
> because I'd like to write a somewhat complicated defsystem that calls
> the C compiler for help, but I know that the support for this is
> completely ad-hack in DS 3.x.

One of the main stumbling blocks in the development of MK4 is the
design of the "foreign compiler" interface.  I have not settled on a
design but I think I may be close enough.  Please see the
'language-support' file and the 'languages' subdirectory.


You are most welcome to pitch in.  The CVS module is called
`defsystem-4.x' in the CLOCC repository.  Note that this is a
standalone module which does not require the rest of the CLOCC.


> Also, I'd like to just use the CLOS
> based DS 4 and never look back, if I can.  DS3 has grown too klugified
> for my tastes...

Same here.  This was the reason for going to MK4.

Cheers

-- 
Marco Antoniotti ========================================================
NYU Courant Bioinformatics Group        tel. +1 - 212 - 998 3488
719 Broadway 12th Floor                 fax  +1 - 212 - 995 4122
New York, NY 10003, USA                 http://bioinformatics.cat.nyu.edu
                    "Hello New York! We'll do what we can!"
                           Bill Murray in `Ghostbusters'.
From: Joel Ray Holveck
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <y7cfzzs6xxf.fsf@sindri.juniper.net>
> Official answer.  MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x specs are (so far)  upward
> compatible with MK:DEFSYSTEM 4.x.

Speaking of specs, is either version of MK:DEFSYSTEM documented
anywhere?  I've pretty much been working off of other other sysdcl
files, and other defsystems to work out how to use MK.

Thanks,
joelh
From: Raymond Toy
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <4n8z5kjhy6.fsf@edgedsp4.rtp.ericsson.se>
>>>>> "Joel" == Joel Ray Holveck <·····@juniper.net> writes:

    >> Official answer.  MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x specs are (so far)  upward
    >> compatible with MK:DEFSYSTEM 4.x.

    Joel> Speaking of specs, is either version of MK:DEFSYSTEM documented
    Joel> anywhere?  I've pretty much been working off of other other sysdcl
    Joel> files, and other defsystems to work out how to use MK.

There is a description of 3.x somewhere, but, oddly, it doesn't seem
to be with the clocc version.  I have a version that I think I got
from the CMU AI archives quite a while a go.  I seem to remember
having the original sources (in Scribe?) as well.  It will take a bit
of time to dig this up.

Ray
From: Thomas F. Burdick
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <xcvk7p4ncyq.fsf@conquest.OCF.Berkeley.EDU>
Raymond Toy <···@rtp.ericsson.se> writes:

> >>>>> "Joel" == Joel Ray Holveck <·····@juniper.net> writes:
> 
>     >> Official answer.  MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x specs are (so far)  upward
>     >> compatible with MK:DEFSYSTEM 4.x.
> 
>     Joel> Speaking of specs, is either version of MK:DEFSYSTEM documented
>     Joel> anywhere?  I've pretty much been working off of other other sysdcl
>     Joel> files, and other defsystems to work out how to use MK.
> 
> There is a description of 3.x somewhere, but, oddly, it doesn't seem
> to be with the clocc version.  I have a version that I think I got
> from the CMU AI archives quite a while a go.  I seem to remember
> having the original sources (in Scribe?) as well.  It will take a bit
> of time to dig this up.

There's a PostScript file in the contrib/ directory of the CMUCL
source, along with the defsystem source.

-- 
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     ,--'    _,'   | Wage class war!       |                        
    /       /      `-----------------------'                        
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   |     ) |                               
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   `. )----'                               
From: Daniel Barlow
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <87d6uwot10.fsf@noetbook.telent.net>
Raymond Toy <···@rtp.ericsson.se> writes:

>>>>>> "Joel" == Joel Ray Holveck <·····@juniper.net> writes:
>     Joel> Speaking of specs, is either version of MK:DEFSYSTEM documented
>     Joel> anywhere?  I've pretty much been working off of other other sysdcl
>     Joel> files, and other defsystems to work out how to use MK.
>
> There is a description of 3.x somewhere, but, oddly, it doesn't seem
> to be with the clocc version.  I have a version that I think I got

Try

http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/project/ai-repository/ai/lang/lisp/code/tools/mkantdoc.tgz

(this URL also appears on the mk-defsystem cliki page at
http://ww.telent.net/cliki/mk-defsystem)


-dan

-- 

  http://ww.telent.net/cliki/ - Link farm for free CL-on-Unix resources 
From: Marco Antoniotti
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <y6cptyvtcnp.fsf@octagon.mrl.nyu.edu>
Raymond Toy <···@rtp.ericsson.se> writes:

> >>>>> "Joel" == Joel Ray Holveck <·····@juniper.net> writes:
> 
>     >> Official answer.  MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x specs are (so far)  upward
>     >> compatible with MK:DEFSYSTEM 4.x.
> 
>     Joel> Speaking of specs, is either version of MK:DEFSYSTEM documented
>     Joel> anywhere?  I've pretty much been working off of other other sysdcl
>     Joel> files, and other defsystems to work out how to use MK.
> 
> There is a description of 3.x somewhere, but, oddly, it doesn't seem
> to be with the clocc version.  I have a version that I think I got
> from the CMU AI archives quite a while a go.  I seem to remember
> having the original sources (in Scribe?) as well.  It will take a bit
> of time to dig this up.


There is a description of the original MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.x in the
AI.Repository.  It is not included n the CLOCC repository because it
is part of a CMU TR on a set of "Lisp Utilities" by Mark Kantrowitz's
(all very useful, e.g. the "user-manual" one).  Unfortunately, maybe
because of me (and others) being paranoid about the CMU copyrights,
the document is not included in the CLOCC repository.

I will amend this, by adding a README file to the repository.

As for 4.x, I am very slowly writing an "internals" document.  Anybody
willing to help is welcome.  Send me email privately for that.

Cheers

-- 
Marco Antoniotti ========================================================
NYU Courant Bioinformatics Group        tel. +1 - 212 - 998 3488
719 Broadway 12th Floor                 fax  +1 - 212 - 995 4122
New York, NY 10003, USA                 http://bioinformatics.cat.nyu.edu
                    "Hello New York! We'll do what we can!"
                           Bill Murray in `Ghostbusters'.
From: Marco Antoniotti
Subject: MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.3i relased in the CLOCC project.
Date: 
Message-ID: <y6ck7p3jdp6.fsf_-_@octagon.mrl.nyu.edu>
Hi

a new updated releas of MK:DEFSYSTEM has been uploaded to the File
Release area of the CLOCC project

	http://sourceforge.net/projects/clocc

The new release is tagged 3.3i and contains the latest CVS additions
and a README file with a pointer to the documentation at CMU.

Enjoy

-- 
Marco Antoniotti ========================================================
From: Marco Antoniotti
Subject: [ANNOUNCEMENT] MK:DEFSYSTEM 3.3i relased in the CLOCC project.
Date: 
Message-ID: <y6cd6uvjdm2.fsf_-_@octagon.mrl.nyu.edu>
Hi

a new updated releas of MK:DEFSYSTEM has been uploaded to the File
Release area of the CLOCC project

	http://sourceforge.net/projects/clocc

The new release is tagged 3.3i and contains the latest CVS additions
and a README file with a pointer to the documentation at CMU.

Enjoy

-- 
Marco Antoniotti ========================================================
From: Paolo Amoroso
Subject: Re: Question about DEFSYSTEM status
Date: 
Message-ID: <mfUJPXMlqAYuuBKnaS+7gJiQoHL5@4ax.com>
On 12 Jun 2002 17:38:41 -0400, Raymond Toy <···@rtp.ericsson.se> wrote:

> There is a description of 3.x somewhere, but, oddly, it doesn't seem
> to be with the clocc version.  I have a version that I think I got
> from the CMU AI archives quite a while a go.  I seem to remember

Its distribution license may not be open-source compatible. Some time ago
Mark Kantrowitz granted Marco Antoniotti some rights to the MK:DEFSYSTEM
code, but I don't know about the documentation.


Paolo
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EncyCMUCLopedia * Extensive collection of CMU Common Lisp documentation
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