I understand both CAPI and CLIM are Interface Managers. Is it possible to
point out the differences (for example speed)?
Thx.
Janos Blazi
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* Janos Blazi wrote:
> I understand both CAPI and CLIM are Interface Managers. Is it possible to
> point out the differences (for example speed)?
Don't know about CAPI, but while CLIM probably isn't suitable for
video games or something, speed is really not a problem for it
nowadays unless you need to run on old / small machines. I usually
run a CLIM image with debugging turned all the way up on a 3xxMHz Sun
And there's really no performance issue at all. It would probably be
comfortable on a machine half or a quarter of that speed. I have less
idea about memory requirements since we buy lots of memory, but it's
not enormous -- the above development image seems to be maybe 16-24Mb
resident. We certainly lots of Lisps, many with CLIM on the one
machine with no real issues of performance.
Windows versions seem to be similar.
(This is Allegro CL).
--tim
In article <···············@cley.com>, Tim Bradshaw <···@cley.com>
wrote:
> * Janos Blazi wrote:
> > I understand both CAPI and CLIM are Interface Managers. Is it possible to
> > point out the differences (for example speed)?
In LispWorks CLIM is implemented on top of CAPI, AFAIK.
Rainer Joswig, ISION Internet AG, Harburger Schlossstra�e 1,
21079 Hamburg, Germany, Tel: +49 40 77175 226
Email: ·············@ision.de , WWW: http://www.ision.de/
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000 19:11:29 +0100, Rainer Joswig <·············@ision.de>
wrote:
> In article <···············@cley.com>, Tim Bradshaw <···@cley.com>
> wrote:
>
> > * Janos Blazi wrote:
> > > I understand both CAPI and CLIM are Interface Managers. Is it possible to
> > > point out the differences (for example speed)?
>
> In LispWorks CLIM is implemented on top of CAPI, AFAIK.
No. It was some years ago but isn't anymore.
BTW a quick summary of the history is:
Back in the early 90s Harlequin was developing an end-user data visualization
product for PCs (called Watson). At the time the GUI options were
CLX/CLUE/Toolkit and CLIM 0.9/1.0. The main requirements were small size and
native look-and-feel.
We had a great deal of experience with CLX/CLUE/Toolkit since at the time the
LispWorks IDE was written in those. So we looked at porting them to the PC, but
it seemed too awkward to recreate those X-like layers on the PC, and give them
native look-and-feel.
Conversely, CLIM 0.9/1.0 was perceived to be un-native-looking (no adaptive
widgets then) and its class hierarchy was judged too hard to deliver to a small
footprint using the treeshaker.
So Harlequin designed and built CAPI: a small, conventional, easy-to-deliver,
native-look-and-feel, GUI toolkit -- and we used it to write Watson. The first
generation of CAPI was not CLOS-based and had some other idiosyncracies, so we
absorbed those lessons and designed and a next generation of it, and also
called it CAPI. (The first one got renamed CAPI-1 internally and never got
released externally except as part of Watson.)
Watson, and the LispWorks IDE, were rewritten to use CAPI(2). CLIM 2.0 got
adaptive widgets along the way but it was too late for Harlequin's purposes.
Initially we supported CLIM by backending it with CAPI, but both toolkits try
to hide platform details from client code so it was awkward. Now both CAPI and
CLIM have their own native backends.
__Jason
On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 09:49:38 +0000, Jason Trenouth <·····@harlequin.com> wrote:
> [CLIM and CAPI]
BTW if you want to see a follow-on GUI toolkit for a Lisp-like language
co-designed by key CAPI and CLIM folks then take a look at Dylan's DUIM:
http://www.fun-o.com
__Jason
If I understood correctly there is no free Dylan version on that page, on
that can be downloaded like the LispWorks Personal Edition. Is that true?
Janos Blazi
Jason Trenouth <·····@harlequin.com> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag:
····························@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 09:49:38 +0000, Jason Trenouth <·····@harlequin.com>
wrote:
>
> > [CLIM and CAPI]
>
> BTW if you want to see a follow-on GUI toolkit for a Lisp-like language
> co-designed by key CAPI and CLIM folks then take a look at Dylan's DUIM:
> http://www.fun-o.com
>
> __Jason
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> Jason Trenouth <·····@harlequin.com> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag:
> ····························@4ax.com...
> >
> > BTW if you want to see a follow-on GUI toolkit for a Lisp-like language
> > co-designed by key CAPI and CLIM folks then take a look at Dylan's DUIM:
> > http://www.fun-o.com
> >
> > __Jason
On Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:50:23 +0100, "Janos Blazi" <······@netsurf.de> wrote:
> If I understood correctly there is no free Dylan version on that page, on
> that can be downloaded like the LispWorks Personal Edition. Is that true?
> Janos Blazi
That's right. At the moment you have to join the beta program to play with
DUIM.
__Jason
"Janos Blazi" <······@netsurf.de> writes:
> If I understood correctly there is no free Dylan version on that
> page, on that can be downloaded like the LispWorks Personal
> Edition. Is that true?
At http://www.double.co.nz/dylan/tips/tip1.htm I describe how to get
and install the free personal edition of Harlequin Dylan 1.2 for
Windows. The personal edition is fully functional (not time limited or
heap limited and includes application delivery).
The latest beta version of Functional Developer (the successor to
Harlequin Dylan) is very nice and has quite a few improvements over HD
1.2 so if you are interested, contacting Functional Objects for
details on obtaining the beta might be worthwhile.
Chris.
--
http://www.double.co.nz/dylan