From: Graham O'Neil
Subject: RFD:  comp.lang.logo
Date: 
Message-ID: <1992May15.161330.2203@uunet.uu.net>
Request for Discussion:

   Proposed group:  comp.lang.logo

   Status: Unmoderated

   Followup: news.groups

Aims

  The group would serve as a common ground for discussion of the LOGO
  language and its variants [and execution platforms], questions about
  language syntax, constructs, algorithms, and how do you get LOGO to
  DWIM [Do What I Mean].  Exchange of LOGO programs would be
  facilitated.  Experiences, lessons learned and ``What worked for me''
  stories that are posted on this common newsgroup would allow a broad
  range of distribution as well as providing a knowledgeable group of
  contributors for answering questions.


Rationale
   
   There hasn't been enough traffic on any one of the likely groups
   [misc.kids, comp.edu, comp.lang.misc, comp.cog-eng] to recognize the
   need for a LOGO group.  Yet, having a dedicated newsgroup would get
   discussions and trading of packages and experiences on the air, thus
   building the volume.  Certainly the level of discussion on the
   Internet about LOGO suffers because there is no recognized focal point
   or home for it.
   
   As I examine my capture files for the last 18 months, there is a
   nearly constant set of exchanges across 7 or 8 groups of LOGO related
   topics.  There have been also platform related questions and short
   discussions on the .ibm, .apple,, .mac, and .amiga groups.  I am told
   that the k12 hierarchy has a fair volume of electronic exchange.  A
   mailing list or electronic newsletter is available by sending mail to
   ····················@aisb.ed.ac.uk.
   
   Having a common ground for exchange of theories, ideas, programs,
   insights, questions, and even war stories should sustain a high enough
   interest level to be worthwhile.  With international connectivity,
   children, other students, teachers, and practitioners could get a
   global perspective on discussions of their activities, concerns,
   developments, and experiments.
   
   Since the initial round of discussions triggered by James Gow's note
   on comp.ai, I have received about 25 replies showing support and
   offering contributions to a LOGO newsgroup.  Given the usual ratios
   of lurkers to correspondents, it is time to discuss any remaining
   issues in establishing a newsgroup for the LOGO community.

Focus
   
   The proposed newsgroup is focused on the LOGO approach to education,
   exploration, and programming in LOGO.  This focus highlights these
   facets:
   
   *  The LOGO Language itself, including how to get started,
   programming questions, resources, and reference materials.
   
   *  LOGO applications and development information including: design
   issues, utilities, experiences with LOGO use, new features or
   capabilities [e.g. Lego-LOGO], and implementation issues for interpreter
   developers.  This area would also serve as a focal point for software
   trading, reviews and requests for available packages.
   
   *  LOGO for educational, pedagogical, development or cognitive
   discipline support.
   
   *  General discussion on the uses of the LOGO language for
   education, prototyping, exploratory programming, microworld
   development, tooling, AI-Education topics, classroom experiences and
   research results.


Scope
   
   In addition to topics and discussion areas already listed, other
   types of questions that might arise include some of these examples:

   *  Why does my school system insist on teaching LOGO to only advanced
   students when that was clearly not the goal of the language designers
   and developers?

   *  How can I get my school system to use LOGO to replace the
   Electronic Worksheets they are using now?

   *  Anyone want to get a group buy together for Lego LOGO and see if
   Dacta will give us a group discount?

   *  When and where are the good LOGO conferences this year?

   *  Has anyone read the book ``LOGO's Good Gnus ''?  Is it any good?

   *  Why are there so few microworlds outside the realm of
   mathematics?

   *  How do I get started with LOGO for my children at home?

Naming
   
   Roughly half the 25 respondents favored the name comp.lang.logo over
   the other likely candidates.  Several mentioned the charter should
   clearly state the newsgroup is an umbrella for questions beyond the
   language.  In the spirit of comp.lang.{scheme|lisp|clos}, discussions
   would also include use, applications, pedagogy, theories, and any
   relevant cognitive sciences or development topics.  
   
   The out of the blue suggestion that I liked best however was either
   comp.mindstorms or alt.mindstorms.  The .alt is rejected because many
   sites limit distribution.

Responses

   Followup is set to news.groups.  Questions may be addressed by E-Mail
   to either James Gow or me.  Inputs from the discussion will shape the
   charter that will be posted with the CFV.

Acknowledgements
   
   The following individuals have been generous in contributing their
   thoughts, but bear no responsibility for defects in this note.
   
   ··@anarres.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Brian Harvey)
   ···@inf.fu-berlin.de       (Debora Weber-Wulff)
   ····@novavax.nova.edu      (James Gow)
   
graham
-- 
Graham O'Neil    ·····@aio.jsc.nasa.gov      ······@nasamail  
Lockheed  2400 NASA RD 1 Houston, TX 77058  (713)333-7197
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